Remove Dodge

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try uhhhh

rushing their cover when their dodge runs out

seriously grub, i know if you had it your way this whole game would be a stationary turn-based RPG but goddamn the whole game doesn't have to be played passively
if you think rushing them while their dodge is down is viable in any way you must play against some real retards man. even if you assume they wasted it for nothing and got 0 damage on you while using their dodge, usually by the time you get to them (even if they havent noticed you running in their face and ran further back to regen dodge points) theyll still get to have a few ticks of dodge points and probably end up dodging at least 1 or 2 more shots. oh and guess what, they can do the same to you and just get in your face because your dodge is always down. and you won't get any damage on them while they're doing that because it's impossible to drain their dodge points in time

dodge 2 probably gives an average player somewhere in the vicinity of 400-600 EHP boost for 10 points and someone who really knows how to squeeze everything out of it and is on the defending team easily gets more like 1000 hp worth in shots dodged per round. imagine thinking that's balanced. dodge is overpowered as fuck and everyone that's played against a half decent player using it knows it

the drains in mid range aren't enough, the range multiplier decreases too quickly and the points regen too fast
 

Fang

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like force, dodge is regenerative armor

armor is not required, invest in a sec nade instead lol

i think the regen is okay but i definitely agree with:
headshots - reward skill, no immunity, all guns
cqc dodge - 1 shot maybe if full, but that's it or not work at all
medium, 3-4 maybe or something that keeps us pushing forward
long range, dodge for days, its a pushing up tool

i reiterate that taking it way back to sniper only will make it a useless skill, keep it for all weapons but basically increase drain time

idk whether to take away shooting ability cuz it helps us push up at the same time - my preference is leave it alone personally and if it doesnt work at cqc wont matter too much
 
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even if you assume they wasted it for nothing and got 0 damage on you while using their dodge, usually by the time you get to them (even if they havent noticed you running in their face and ran further back to regen dodge points) theyll still get to have a few ticks of dodge points and probably end up dodging at least 1 or 2 more shots.

the drains in mid range aren't enough, the range multiplier decreases too quickly and the points regen too fast
hold mb2 with an e-11 equipped

i think the regen is okay but i definitely agree with:
headshots - reward skill, no immunity, all guns
I like the idea of skilled shooters killing with headshots but maaaaybe if this were to be implemented it should be at close-mid-range.
 
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try uhhhh

rushing their cover when their dodge runs out

seriously grub, i know if you had it your way this whole game would be a stationary turn-based RPG but goddamn the whole game doesn't have to be played passively
Dodge regens too quickly, so by the time you get there they'll most likely have it back. If you rush them they'll use the amount of dodge they just regained and shoot you to death. And you know the last part of your response about how I'd have it isn't true, don't be absurd.
 
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hold mb2 with an e-11 equipped



I like the idea of skilled shooters killing with headshots but maaaaybe if this were to be implemented it should be at close-mid-range.
So just shoot at them is what you're saying? Okay then they'll shoot back at you, except you can't hurt them yet. It shouldn't take having to resort to headshots only since they can still hit any part of your body while they use dodge.
 
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So just shoot at them is what you're saying? Okay then they'll shoot back at you, except you can't hurt them yet. It shouldn't take having to resort to headshots only since they can still hit any part of your body while they use dodge.
Dodge is a utility for pushing up. If you can get right on them when they duck behind cover, they won't have a full charge of dodge ready for a rapid-fire assault.
 
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Dodge is a utility for pushing up. If you can get right on them when they duck behind cover, they won't have a full charge of dodge ready for a rapid-fire assault.
What it was intended for is irrelevant, it always gives you the edge in situations where you would have gotten shot. It allows for even more plays that you can get away with where the other classes that don't have dodge could never get away with. The only time you should not get shot is when you were fast enough or made good enough decisions to not get shot. Ik that isn't always possible, but it makes it even less possible for people going up against dodge.
 
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Get rid of dodge and everyone will just be using pistol 3(which they do already), snipers, and burst weapons. Best way to balance it would be to make headshots hit no matter what. Gunner gameplay is tough enough, it does need some changes but removal is excessive. The regen rate could also be a good place to start, it's pretty fast.
 
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Get rid of dodge and everyone will just be using pistol 3(which they do already), snipers, and burst weapons. Best way to balance it would be to make headshots hit no matter what. Gunner gameplay is tough enough, it does need some changes but removal is excessive. The regen rate could also be a good place to start, it's pretty fast.
Everyone who plays hero uses dodge, proj and p3. People who use dodge on elite troopers use burst weapons as well, thus by your logic makes them even more broken. Nearly every mechanic in the game is used frequently, so saying that people will just use something else if dodge is removed is a pointless argument. Because if it's the next best thing then they are already using it, and if they aren't then they are either using a build they consider to be entertaining or they are just using dodge. I doubt many people will miss dodge if the mechanic is removed, it's a dumb one that should have never existed in the first place, and to say that the balance of the game would be much worse without it or that everyone will change the way they play is absurd.
 
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Everyone who plays hero uses dodge, proj and p3. People who use dodge on elite troopers use burst weapons as well, thus by your logic makes them even more broken. Nearly every mechanic in the game is used frequently, so saying that people will just use something else if dodge is removed is a pointless argument. Because if it's the next best thing then they are already using it, and if they aren't then they are either using a build they consider to be entertaining or they are just using dodge. I doubt many people will miss dodge if the mechanic is removed, it's a dumb one that should have never existed in the first place, and to say that the balance of the game would be much worse without it or that everyone will change the way they play is absurd.
No what is truly absurd is calling for the removal of a game mechanic without trying to comprehend the consequences of said removal. You don't have to look far to see this in action, the removal of flinch completely ruined gunner vs jedi gameplay for a period of time. Minor changes over time are always better then just cutting a mechanic straight out, especially one that has been in the game for a while such as dodge. I think everyone can agree it needs to be changed, but it's important not to be rash.
 

Crusader

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I pray, one day, my fellow homoerectus (in the gay way) will be able to read and understand the impending changes rather than inanely ramble about changes that could-have-been-would-have-been.

Five pages worth of shit-talk for a change that is guaranteed to come.

P.S. qwerty is 100% correct.
 
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No what is truly absurd is calling for the removal of a game mechanic without trying to comprehend the consequences of said removal. You don't have to look far to see this in action, the removal of flinch completely ruined gunner vs jedi gameplay for a period of time. Minor changes over time are always better then just cutting a mechanic straight out, especially one that has been in the game for a while such as dodge. I think everyone can agree it needs to be changed, but it's important not to be rash.
Flinch also ruined saber v gun gameplay for a time when it replaced what we have now (knockback on hit), according to the people who were playing at the time. I do agree that dodge need not be removed, but should at least be nerfed back down to what it was not even 4 years ago, when the only thing it could dodge was sniper fire, and even then, only anything below the head. It will maintain it's intended purpose, and not be as broken as it is now, where it can be the deciding factor of most close range strafe duels.
 
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No what is truly absurd is calling for the removal of a game mechanic without trying to comprehend the consequences of said removal. You don't have to look far to see this in action, the removal of flinch completely ruined gunner vs jedi gameplay for a period of time. Minor changes over time are always better then just cutting a mechanic straight out, especially one that has been in the game for a while such as dodge. I think everyone can agree it needs to be changed, but it's important not to be rash.
That was saber vs gunner, and it was ruined because knockback did nothing. And you are right when you say "minor changes over time are always better than just cutting a mechanic straight out" but in this case the game would be better if it was removed, though you are right when you say it doesn't HAVE to be removed I suppose. As Rosh said, make it only work against snipers. Though I still think saying "everyone will move onto using this mechanic" or "the balance would be much worse" over the removal of one broken mechanic is still false.
 
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Flinch also ruined saber v gun gameplay for a time when it replaced what we have now (knockback on hit), according to the people who were playing at the time.
that's funny because what actually happened is knockback ruined saber v gun gameplay when it replaced flinch
 
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No what is truly absurd is calling for the removal of a game mechanic without trying to comprehend the consequences of said removal. You don't have to look far to see this in action, the removal of flinch completely ruined gunner vs jedi gameplay for a period of time. Minor changes over time are always better then just cutting a mechanic straight out, especially one that has been in the game for a while such as dodge. I think everyone can agree it needs to be changed, but it's important not to be rash.
Dodge has been in the game since 2002, I don't think people realize the consequences its removal would have
 
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Lots of people have been playing the game continuously for a decade or more. I think many of the posters in this thread are well-positioned to at least imagine and speculate on the ramifications of removing dodge, even if it's widely-acknowledged that dodge is a solution to many gameplay problems. Maybe it's not the best solution (or maybe it is), but it doesn't seem crazy to me that it's on the table as an option.
 
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Dodge is literally the single most retarded ability in the game barring perhaps lightning 3 spam. Only saberists can tank the amount of shots a dodge 2 comm can on defense just by pressing a button, and by sticking a corner you've literally become invincible to all but a saber, force powers, nades, and melee. melee isn't really a viable counter, nades are single use and cost even more, and saberists are, well, saberists. With ee3 sniper nerf all dodge really needs to do is dodge ruptor and proj and it's good enough and suddenly it's a soldier/hero, not a matrix bullet hell instawin button.
 
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Dodge is literally the single most retarded ability in the game barring perhaps lightning 3 spam. Only saberists can tank the amount of shots a dodge 2 comm can on defense just by pressing a button, and by sticking a corner you've literally become invincible to all but a saber, force powers, nades, and melee. melee isn't really a viable counter, nades are single use and cost even more, and saberists are, well, saberists. With ee3 sniper nerf all dodge really needs to do is dodge ruptor and proj and it's good enough and suddenly it's a soldier/hero, not a matrix bullet hell instawin button.
Absolutely this. Though I think commanders should still have dodge but weakened substantially.

Commanders should work as originally intended...

Which was a slightly stronger and faster soldier with special nades, a stronger weapon (comparatively to the e11) and a rally point attached to his player, not the best class on imperials/rebs.
 
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