For the past couple months we have been gathering up ideas and thoughts on how to alter some values to reduce critical breakpoints in the gameplay experience while still staying true to MB2's signature feel. Before even trying them out, we would like to see some discussion on the potential implications and if there are some controversial changes in the mix. None of these changes are final and surely not all of them will ever see the light of day, but many of these ideas attempt to address issues that particularly new players might feel are frustrating.
Note that these changes do not focus on Saber vs Saber mechanics as that is explored elsewhere in Tempest's tweak threads.
General mechanics
The Force:
Lightsaber
Frag Grenade
Clone Rifle
Concussion Grenade
Projectile Rifle
Westar M5
Bowcaster
EE3
Disruptor
That was a lot more than I expected. Please take your time to read and think about these changes. As said above, none of them are set in stone and are more-so starting points rather than final values.
We would love to hear your thoughts. What sounds good? What sounds bad? Why? I am fond of all of these changes and truly believe they make the game more nuanced without feeling too heavy-handed. I am sure we'll disagree on some of the more drastic points, but I would love to see you also highlight which of the changes make the game better even if you feel strongly against some other features.
Note that these changes do not focus on Saber vs Saber mechanics as that is explored elsewhere in Tempest's tweak threads.
General mechanics
- Getup from knockdown activates 0.5-1 second sooner for single life classes
- Getup animation from knockdowns changed to a sped up Soldier getup animation while on the ground (mid-air getup is still current coinflip)
- Can't hack objectives while on fire
- All single life classes can sideroll upon knockdown except SBD
- Sonic detonator stuns count as assists
- Incendiary Grenade flames stop dealing TK points after being lit for 5 seconds
- Assist TKs can be punished
- A primed grenade will tick passively to alert for corner camps
These changes would be focused towards reducing frustration, fixing oversights and small changes to make the game look a bit better. The most significant of these are the changes to how knockdowns look and feel.
Currently the knockdown is a very powerful mechanic that creates tension during a fight and allows for powerful crowd control abilities to be potent. It is one of the big things that sets MB2 apart from everything else. However it can prove very frustrating and can feel unavoidable for the less experienced players. By slightly reducing the time it takes for the getup and giving additional control over your destiny, we hope to alleviate general frustration while slightly reducing the game-ending impact of a knockdown.
All primed grenades will tick similar to Concussion Grenades to allow players to detect corner ambushes more reliably. This will also help players read the battlefield better as they can now determine if a grenade has been primed or not without having to hear the priming beeps.
The Force:
- Pull vulnerability frames changed to match Push
- Push costs changed from 2-2-8 to 2-4-8. Single target knockdown added for Push 2.
- Lightning only stuns for the frames that it hits
- FP drains are no longer capped when not blocking
These changes to the way the Force works are slight tweaks to reduce frustrating behaviour in Pull and Lightning. There was a big cool factor in hitting snipes on Jedi/Sith who were playing carelessly, so we would like to bring that back.
Push 3 is generally perceived to be very powerful and easy to use considering its utility. We are thinking of an indirect nerf by making it cost 2 points more to access. Boosting Push 2 would encourage players to save points for other abilities as long as they are comfortable with aiming at their intended targets. People who can do single-target pushing reliably will be able to do so with less points. However, if someone wants to be a crowd control powerhouse, that is still possible, just with an added cost.
Lightsaber
- Passive deflects should never fly behind the deflecter
- Increase Flinch range to match Close IDR for better consistency
- Staff/Duals cost to 0
- Staff/Duals defense arc to match regular stances
These behavioural changes explain themselves for most part. Staff and Duals are made more accessible, but they lose their defensive bonus. Flinch becomes more reliable and both players can expect a specific result when getting shot.
Frag Grenade
- Secondary throw FP drain removed
Knockdown is already punishing enough. It also feels inconsistent as it is the only explosive that does this.
Clone Rifle
- Reduce velocity of both blobs by 15%
The Clone Rifle's blob blasts have become very fast over the course of the years almost sneakily. This has removed a certain feeling of pride and accomplishment from landing air blobs on mandalorians. This also reduces the game ending power the Blob currently holds over Jedi/Sith.
Concussion Grenade
- Direct hits explode on impact dealing extra damage (10-20 HP)
Bring back some of the old Primary Grenade feel to the Soldier class while giving the Double Conc Build a bit more oomph.
Projectile Rifle
- Remove firing delay while scoping
- Introduce focus mechanic: Stand still for 1.5s to fire a 100% accurate shot. Visually decrease crosshair size in the same fashion as EE3 until accuracy achieved
- Adjust ammo available per level 8-12-18
Give the Projectile Rifle back its possibility of quickscoping, but create a requirement of having a setup for making clear shots. Ammo amounts available are also tweaked to make sniping a more conscious decision as it cannot be done wastefully.
Westar M5
- Increase sniper ammo cost so that the clip can fit 1 less sniper shot
- Decrease sniper shot base damage by 3
The M5 is largely where it needs to be, but being able to fire so many shots in succession reduces the feeling of every shot counting. In similar fashion the base damage would be decreased just slightly to emphasize the importance of landing two consecutive shots for the kill.
Bowcaster
- Implement a curved damage increase for the charged shot like with the Disruptor
- Include a sound effect for charging the shot
- Fully charged shots are always accurate
The rapid fire/charged shot swap has made the gun feel more like its own thing. It no longer feels like an overpowered E11, even if only at Level 2. The charged shot is given more emphasis while also slightly reducing its initial damage output, while keeping the maximum charge damage the same. Currently the damage adds up too fast resulting in high damage with very little charging required. These changes just nudge us more towards making the gun feel as punchy as it felt like in Episode 7.
EE3
- Sniper shot damage decreased from 100 to 90
The sniper shot damage is reduced slightly to emphasize shots that land on the chest and head.
Disruptor
- Primary shots pass through targets
- Increase reload time by 20%
MeleeThe non-scoped mode gets a fun feature that should make it an interesting option in a tight hallway. The Disruptor reloads very fast and this leaves very small timing windows for enemies to relocate and suppress. Increasing reload time should make sniping a more responsible decision.
- Legsweep no longer knocks down if the target is crouching
Poison DartThis behaviour inconsistent and the legsweep has a very large hitbox, so knocking down players with it is not exactly as thrilling and skillful as it should be. Now players have some counterplay against it.
- Reduce duration by 33%
Poison can feel like a very frustrating ability when stacked as it forces a player out of the fight. It also grants the Bountyhunter a long timing window for pressure or even securing the kill. This change should increase significance of landing consecutive darts and gives the Bountyhunter less time to capitalize.
That was a lot more than I expected. Please take your time to read and think about these changes. As said above, none of them are set in stone and are more-so starting points rather than final values.
We would love to hear your thoughts. What sounds good? What sounds bad? Why? I am fond of all of these changes and truly believe they make the game more nuanced without feeling too heavy-handed. I am sure we'll disagree on some of the more drastic points, but I would love to see you also highlight which of the changes make the game better even if you feel strongly against some other features.
Last edited:
