Stamina for gloans

[BigBossBigTeef]

Wanted to bring up stamina bar for clones in the arc thread but decided to make trooper a different thread instead.
The stamina thing makes sense on arcs, because they need special meter to do rolls, back flips and basically anything cool looking.
But its kinda useless on the clone trooper, like you can get where you need to go without putting a single point in stamina.

Because the default rate stam recharges is actually pretty good without any points in it, so what I am going to ask is has there been anything discussed about the stamina internally and if anyone has any ideas to make it more useful in general without breaking the game.

What I was thinking was that stam could be a little passive defense buff but nothing compared to the buffs the SBD armor gives, and every time you take a hit your stam bar goes down. And when your stam bar runs out, you loose the buff entirely. You should probably nerf their default armor value to compensate the passive armor. Your sprint should still be tied to the stam bar, so if you sprint your bar should still go down naturally. Regen rate should stay at the default values.
The tiers of the stam could be.

1. 6pts-4% blaster defense
   
2. 12pts-8% blaster defense
   
3. 18pts-12% blaster defense, and 5% explosive defense.

Or here is another idea for stamina, rename it to sprint. And each upgrade improves natural travel speed. And remove stam bar entirely.

1. 4pts- 1% speed increase
2. 8pts- 3% speed increase
3. 16pts- 5% speed increase with faster walking speed

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

I don't think clones would have any uses for pulse grenades though when ion blobs are cheap and more effective.

Emp blasts sink like stones, and you need to charge them for their distance to be used.
Pulse grenades you can throw and stick to walls or enemies with a bigger aoe, you can also lob them over cover. My favorite is sticking them to a SBD and he walks into his team and his whole squad gets knocked down.

Emp blasts are a cheaper and weaker pulse. The clone can certainly benefit from having pulse grenades, their application to situations are certainly more handy than the emp blasts.

 

[GoodOl'Ben]

If we're into brainstorming, I've always been fond of regenerating shields. It would need to be presented as a big trade-off of course. More long-term durability for sacrificing 2-3 of these: blobs/reinforcement/armour/firepower. It could potentially add more legitimate viability to a single-life Clonetrooper, which has always kind of been encouraged, but with moderate results.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

If we're into brainstorming, I've always been fond of regenerating shields. It would need to be presented as a big trade-off of course. More long-term durability for sacrificing 2-3 of these: blobs/reinforcement/armour/firepower. It could potentially add more legitimate viability to a single-life Clonetrooper, which has always kind of been encouraged, but with moderate results.

I suggested something similar for something regenerating armor and that was a common pool utility droid class.
They would drop ammo and armor pick ups and they have a skill to increase objective interaction speed.

Make a droid class, be universal. Basically the R2D2 class.
Skills

• Pistol 1
• Shock arm: (not sure, my idea is that its a weak force lighting)
• Stun laser: you hit somebody and they cant run only walk for a short duration. Upgrade determines number of shots. 2-4-6.
• Interaction speed: 1.2-1.6-2.0 (faster console hacking, and objective interactions)
  
• Ammo drops: 50%-100%-150%
• Armor drop: 15-30-60
• Travel speed: wookie speed- average- clone sprint speed

Then the typical ammo and armor.

Downside, 50hp 50 armor, has very shitty combat capabilities.

 

[StarWarsGeek]

Emp blasts are a cheaper and weaker pulse. The clone can certainly benefit from having pulse grenades, their application to situations are certainly more handy than the emp blasts.

They're only sticky when used with the M5 attachment. Pulses require you to switch weapon to use, and people have time to run away from them before they explode. Ion blobs explode on impact and, when charged a bit, stun for longer than the knockdown from pulses would be. Blobs also travel much faster than pulses. Pulses' ammo drain is negligible against most classes except SBD and deka, as is the damage.

Whenever I play with pulses, I find myself wishing I had spent those points elsewhere as ARC or switched to clone. For a long time, pulses existed mainly just to be the hard counter to SBDs and dekas. Ever since ion blobs were introduced, I feel like they've taken over pulses jobs and do it more efficiently. If pulses were significantly cheaper, it might be another story.

If we're into brainstorming, I've always been fond of regenerating shields. It would need to be presented as a big trade-off of course. More long-term durability for sacrificing 2-3 of these: blobs/reinforcement/armour/firepower. It could potentially add more legitimate viability to a single-life Clonetrooper, which has always kind of been encouraged, but with moderate results.

This is something I'd really like to see too, and it fits very well with the class thematically because of Republic Commandos. Multiple levels that influence regen rate would be good, with anything higher than level 1 or 2 being too costly to buy with a reinforcement or rifle 3.

 

[Mr_Oujamaflip]

What if clone rifle had the same attachment as M5 for pulse grenades? Would only be accessible with CR2 of course. Because they're so hard to push firing them and following on with a rocket works really well in team situations.

As for regenerating shields I think it could work if it was like heal for heroes but affecting armour.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

They're only sticky when used with the M5 attachment. Pulses require you to switch weapon to use, and people have time to run away from them before they explode. Ion blobs explode on impact and, when charged a bit, stun for longer than the knockdown from pulses would be. Blobs also travel much faster than pulses. Pulses' ammo drain is negligible against most classes except SBD and deka, as is the damage.

Emps cannot compete with the larger AOE, and knock down effect the pulse grenades provide.
They can be used without exposing myself or peaking around the corner. And they actually slow down sith users if they miss the push, because of the knock down.

Even if the stick effect only occurs on the grenade launcher attachment, the fact I can stick somebody and they walk into their team makes it much more worthwhile to me. Perhaps the M5 and grenade attachment could be added to the class, for single reinforcement builds.

 

[Mr_Oujamaflip]

Emps cannot compete with the larger AOE, and knock down effect they provide.
Even if the stick effect occurs on the grenade launcher attachment, the fact I can stick somebody and they walk into their team makes it much more worthwhile to me. Perhaps the M5 and grenade attachment could be added to the class, for single reinforcement builds.

Get out of my brain.

 

[StarWarsGeek]

Emps cannot compete with the larger AOE, and knock down effect the pulse grenades provide.
They can be used without exposing myself or peaking around the corner. And they actually slow down sith users if they miss the push, because of the knock down.

Even if the stick effect only occurs on the grenade launcher attachment, the fact I can stick somebody and they walk into their team makes it much more worthwhile to me. Perhaps the M5 and grenade attachment could be added to the class, for single reinforcement builds.

The stun duration can definitely compete with the knockdowns. The smaller AOE on ions is made up for with faster travel time and exploding on impact. Ions have enough AOE to hit people just around corners too. The only advantage I see is being able to stick people who panic and screw up their team. While hilarious, I don't like investing 15+ pts in something that relies heavily on my opponent(s) playing poorly.

And adding M5 w/ grenade attachment is pointless when ARC already has it, especially if it's expensive enough to prevent buying reinforcements. At that point you're basically an ARC trooper with less hp/armor and no dexterity. Adding new, unique weapons that bring new options to the table is better than just spreading around weapons that already exist.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

And adding M5 w/ grenade attachment is pointless when ARC already has it, especially if it's expensive enough to prevent buying reinforcements. At that point you're basically an ARC trooper with less hp/armor and no dexterity. Adding new, unique weapons that bring new options to the table is better than just spreading around weapons that already exist.

That is why I said the grenade launcher aspect should be removed from ARC and be added to clone.
Heavy explosives don't fit a class designed to be acrobatic, same for the missile launcher.

I firmly believe the Arc class should be the rebels mobility class, where the CT is the heavy gunner class.

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

I'm okay with the idea of Clones getting a melee attack, as long as you nerf the hell out of blobs/CR3 before doing so.

 

[Supa]

Blobs are a little bit ridiculous. Having 9, hell even have 6 per life is pretty ridiculous. I liked the idea when they shared ammo with clone rifle, but they needed to drain the entire clip, not just part of it.

As for clone rifle 3, I think increasing spread over time might be something to try out. Being able to hold down the mouse button and spray an endless stream of fire that is fairly accurate is silly.

 

[Onysfx]

As for clone rifle 3, I think increasing spread over time might be something to try out. Being able to hold down the mouse button and spray an endless stream of fire that is fairly accurate is silly.

Unless you're using the chaingun model of the clone rifle that has no blobs or ions, that should remain 100 percent accurate XD.

 

[Supa]

That was brought up earlier in this thread if I remember correctly; separating chaingun from main clone rifle.

 

[Preston]

Blobs are a little bit ridiculous. Having 9, hell even have 6 per life is pretty ridiculous. I liked the idea when they shared ammo with clone rifle, but they needed to drain the entire clip, not just part of it.

As for clone rifle 3, I think increasing spread over time might be something to try out. Being able to hold down the mouse button and spray an endless stream of fire that is fairly accurate is silly.

But but but, its so much fun blobbing sith and mandos from the sky ; (

 

[Supa]

But but but, its so much fun blobbing sith and mandos from the sky ; (

But can it really be considered skill if you have 9 chances to try?

 

[qwerty]

But can it really be considered skill if you have 9 chances to try?

yes

one has nothing to do with the other

if you had a million blobs they would still take the same amount of skill to use effectively

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

But can it really be considered skill if you have 9 chances to try?

If blob and emp are going to be in the same ammo pool, how would you shoot sombody if you actually manged to hit someone with a knock down.

Reloading would waste time and you loose the chance to kill whoever you knocked down because you are reloading. Nerf the amount to 2 per upgrade if you have too but people loosing their entire clip for one knock down they can't even capitalize on, is going to hurt.

Like unless concussion does actual damage if you land the hit would be a different story, but that would be a nightmare to balance.

 

[Preston]

But can it really be considered skill if you have 9 chances to try?

It is If I can land all of them

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

The potential of being able to land a blob far outweighs the skill in landing them, and it is overpowered. The potential of being able to annihilate a room full of gunners with melee/bowcaster Wook, far outweighs the skill in using it, which is to say very little. Thus it is overpowered.

There is a skill:reward ratio that needs to be kept in balance, but it must also be balanced by other such classes. If you have one class that is super easy to use, but then has an incredibly high reward ratio as your skill goes up, then a more difficult class is completely useless.

This is why most light-side gunner-classes are broken, because they are brain-dead easy compared to the dark side classes, and thus stronger in general. Even if the dark side classes, when fully mastered, are unbeatable, the skill required to use them makes them substantially less effective than the light side classes.

How many new players could you train to be effective Wookies in a day, and how many could you train to be effective commanders?

 

[Preston]

The potential of being able to land a blob far outweighs the skill in landing them, and it is overpowered. The potential of being able to annihilate a room full of gunners with melee/bowcaster Wook, far outweighs the skill in using it, which is to say very little. Thus it is overpowered.

There is a skill:reward ratio that needs to be kept in balance, but it must also be balanced by other such classes. If you have one class that is super easy to use, but then has an incredibly high reward ratio as your skill goes up, then a more difficult class is completely useless.

This is why most light-side gunner-classes are broken, because they are brain-dead easy compared to the dark side classes, and thus stronger in general. Even if the dark side classes, when fully mastered, are unbeatable, the skill required to use them makes them substantially less effective than the light side classes.

How many new players could you train to be effective Wookies in a day, and how many could you train to be effective commanders?

Actually more commanders.