Someone Explain

[just. мỖήｉｋａ.]

Can someone explain to me why the devs thought it would be good to turn open mode into w+m1=jedi/sith simulator? I feel with each patch it gets worse and worse. I would also like to know what brain dead dev decided to give them damage reduction and let them block 100 e11 shots then run away unharmed, or better yet allow a sith to paralyze you with lightning and a gunner being unable to do anything about it, or when a jedi pushes you 100 feet away and force speeds to you and kills you with no effort. Thanks devs more ruining open and making jedi/sith the easy class and blocking parts of the map that are used because "timewasting" which thats why server admins are a thing btw.

 

[Gargos]

Jedi/sith has received more nerfs than buffs in the last couple patches.

 

[PuNk]

You can avoid being pushed by walking. Sith are vulnerable to your teammatesaround while lightning you. You can use blobs/nades/melee to knock down a saberist coming for you if you didn't drain their FP enough and while server admins ARE a thing, they are not available 24/7 to babysit the game. Open is more fun than ever for me these days, skilled gunner can kill a saberist and vice versa, don't know what you're complaining about.

 

[Liniyka_xddd]

I feel like this post was written back when we had 0.65 block FP modifier and op lightning stun.

 

[Gargos]

Lol if I were to get purple perk back with 15 percent less fp dmg + the old fp damage I cant even imagine how much I could tank. It is funny how you get used to things because I think it is rather ok now. I had to leave deflect 3 for a while since it felt like it became useless with fp damage being increased but after 2 months of mb2 Ive adjusted enough to make use of this ability again, even deflect 1 while using def1

 

[Townsend]

The saber players are utterly fair,there is many ways to counter them you just gotta.....G E T.........G U D

 

[Tempest]

ok

 

[Liniyka_xddd]

ok

huh nice passive AGGRESSIVE behaviour from a dev ATTACKING the community and REFUSING to fix the game..... Just implement the MANIFESTO already......

 

[Tylenol]

skilled gunner can kill a saberist

Maybe a completely new guy, because currently an above average gunner just does to a below average saberist 8/10 times

 

[Tylenol]

Last reply got sent early by mistake but oh well

Apart from the maybe Force speed thing, he's not wrong. Current Jedi/Sith is a breeze to play as against gunners. A gunner can press the right button on time and dance the right moves, but 1 misstep and he's dead. Meanwhile, Saberists miss 3 swings, hit the 4th one and move on with 50hp max if not 75. Push has a ridiculous range, and theres moments when even walking you still get pushed. Its something that's happened to me at least 5 times and can be seen here at 1:16.

damage reduction and let them block 100 e11 shots then run away unharmed

Put me on a cross and set me on fire but Achillies is right in suggesting drastically higher FP drains and FP regen for Jedi. Fights shouldn't be overextended staring contests of Jedi sitting there blocking and dominating an area because they have infinite instant kill melee attacks and endless powers that knock you down and make you vunerable to every danger around. Darts actually force Jedi to move and act quickly but is completely useless at medium range where you can't chase them and same with flamethrower since its short-ranged.

better yet allow a sith to paralyze you with lightning and a gunner being unable to do anything about it

Lightning and choke are both a mess, they're guaranteed kills in most conditions because apprently its a good idea to take away any possible counters to enemies if you hold the F button long enough. I'm glad that lightning 3 got nerfed but they're both still a problem.

You can use blobs/nades/melee to knock down a saberist coming for you if you didn't drain their FP enough

Jump recovery from nades and blobs opens Saberists up to such a small amount of damage its laughable. And even then, Clone has blobs attached to their weapon so they dont need to switch back to their main weapon to deal damage, yet Soldiers and ET's miss out on a good chunk of HP because of switching delay.

It's not to mention different issues with gunners themselves, like that Imperials have mechanically better classes, weapons and abilites, how certain maps are biased to one side or another (Rebs on DS, Imps on Kamino).

Its cool and fun to act smug about how good some of us are at the game but realise that there are issues in-game that require a bit of concentration to see.

 

[PuNk]

A gunner can press the right button on time and dance the right moves, but 1 misstep and he's dead. Meanwhile, Saberists miss 3 swings, hit the 4th one and move on with 50hp max if not 75.

As it should be, a jedi or a sith are a fearful force to be reckoned with. They're allowed to make a bit more mistakes. Yet still a skilled gunner will take it down if he does his tricks right.

Jump recovery from nades and blobs opens Saberists up to such a small amount of damage its laughable. And even then, Clone has blobs attached to their weapon so they dont need to switch back to their main weapon to deal damage, yet Soldiers and ET's miss out on a good chunk of HP because of switching delay.

Yes, but this is not a 1 vs 1 game. It's a team game. You alt frag a Sith and suddenly you and your 4 gun buddies just shoot the crap out of him during the getup, tell me if it's laughable damage then? Also, during getup saberists are vulnerable to a proj. rifle killshot.

 

[Crusader]

Play exclusively FP3 SBD w/ cort. until class limit is forced and saber-gun interactions are better addressed/balanced*.

This is the only genuine advice you will get.

(*should be soon after the duel system is fixed for the last time 9-))

 

[Tylenol]

As it should be, a jedi or a sith are a fearful force to be reckoned with. They're allowed to make a bit more mistakes. Yet still a skilled gunner will take it down if he does his tricks right.

Equally skilled players should come out even in fights. Classes can have a minor impact on the score, but it shouldn't be as drastic as it is now. It shouldn't be like Battlefront that you're able to overpower everyone just because you picked the man/woman/alien with the scary glowstick.

Yes, but this is not a 1 vs 1 game. It's a team game. You alt frag a Sith and suddenly you and your 4 gun buddies just shoot the crap out of him during the getup, tell me if it's laughable damage then? Also, during getup saberists are vulnerable to a proj. rifle killshot.

To properly balance a class you need to reduce as many independant varibles as possible EG. an appropirate area to fight on, no distractions and most importantly have it 1 against 1. If we have 2 players of the theoretical same skill level, they should always have approx. equal winrates. Different classes should only have a minimal impact on the score, unlike the current issue we're having.

 

[Gargos]

@Tylenol
Lightning isnt a problem anymore, I honestly wouldn't use it except for the damage of lvl3 or knockdown reasons with lightning push. The stun is too short for it to make any difference in 1v1. Also grip is only useful if you buy grip 3. lvl1 and lvl2 are complete crap. lvl3 costs a lot and you need to be above 65 fp to use it. I do not see it being op.

Also that video of you getting ''walk pushed'', you are clearly in running animation the moment before you get pushed. You didnt walk. I am still yet to see a walk push happen for reals in my 12 years of mb2.

About knockdowns: Youre not giving secondary nades enough credit at all. Fp damage is such a big deal now that getting knockd down and eating couple shots of, for example primary e11 will eat a lot force. I am also able to do secondary nade, switch weapon and get in a t21 primary shot even if the jedi uses quick get up. And blobs are just insane level btw, clones >>>> sith.

 

[PuNk]

Equally skilled players should come out even in fights. Classes can have a minor impact on the score, but it shouldn't be as drastic as it is now. It shouldn't be like Battlefront that you're able to overpower everyone just because you picked the man/woman/alien with the scary glowstick..

You should be if you're highly skileld and know what you're doing. If not - then no, you'll get rekt. Try randomly jumping into a pile of enemy gunners to do any crazy battlefront shit and see where it lands you.

To properly balance a class you need to reduce as many independant varibles as possible EG. an appropirate area to fight on, no distractions and most importantly have it 1 against 1. If we have 2 players of the theoretical same skill level, they should always have approx. equal winrates. Different classes should only have a minimal impact on the score, unlike the current issue we're having.

I absolutely disagree. It's a team game, and each class has different ways of assisting it's team to win, it's not about 1 vs 1. Some classes are naturally less/more useful on some maps or team compositions etc.

 

[Tylenol]

Lightning isnt a problem anymore,.

You mean the abilities that completely blocks any sort of retaliation isn't a problem? I wouldn't mind if ET had some sort of way to counter, like instead of being completely stunend your fire rate is slowed down so that you can only fire a shot every 1.5-2 secs.

The stun is too short for it to make any difference in 1v1

But the damage is strong enough to make one

Also grip is only useful if you buy grip 3. lvl1 and lvl2 are complete crap. lvl3 costs a lot and you need to be above 65 fp to use it. I do not see it being op.

Not overpowered, just stupid for the same reason as lightning. No counters to a something as strong as that is ridiculous.

Also that video of you getting ''walk pushed'', you are clearly in running animation the moment before you get pushed. You didnt walk. I am still yet to see a walk push happen for reals in my 12 years of mb2.

Not my vid, but I've watched the clip frame by frame and yes he does run,about 5 frames before the Jedi pushed. If 5 frames are enough to justify a kill, I guess anything can now.

I absolutely disagree. It's a team game, and each class has different ways of assisting it's team to win, it's not about 1 vs 1. Some classes are naturally less/more useful on some maps or team compositions etc.

So classes aren't supposed to be balanced to be on an even fighting ground? You're completely ignoring my point that 1v1 isnt supposed to be how the game is played but how it's balanced. Imagine if styles cyan got a big buff so that everyone in duels are forced to use it because you're actively putting yourself at a disadvantage for not using it. Open should be about skill, not what class you pick.

You should be if you're highly skileld and know what you're doing. If not - then no, you'll get rekt. Try randomly jumping into a pile of enemy gunners to do any crazy battlefront shit and see where it lands you.

Gunners have to jump through hoops to get kills on saberists, meanwhile Sith can mow through my team because W+M1. much skill

 

[Gargos]

You mean the abilities that completely blocks any sort of retaliation isn't a problem? I wouldn't mind if ET had some sort of way to counter, like instead of being completely stunend your fire rate is slowed down so that you can only fire a shot every 1.5-2 secs.

As I said it is not a problem in 1v1 since the stun ends before you can even hope to swing. I did not like the old lightning since it was a win button but right now it is useless.

But the damage is strong enough to make one

In most cases it is not wise to try to fry an enemy to death. Using lightning also has a cap of 50 fp before you can use it.

Not overpowered, just stupid for the same reason as lightning. No counters to a something as strong as that is ridiculous.

Shooting the gripper is a viable option. If you shoot the gripper below 65 fp he cannot activate grip. Also consider that having grip 3 will make the sith weaker in other aspects since it is such a high cost to get it.

If 5 frames are enough to justify a kill, I guess anything can now.

???? Are you serious or are you just making something up for the sake of disagreeing with my point / me pointing out that your argument was invalid?

So classes aren't supposed to be balanced to be on an even fighting ground?

The game of course tries to make 1v1 as balanced as possible but doing this is plain impossible. How about droideka vs any gunner except ion clone / pulse arc? Or SBD vs anything except clone/arc? or soldier vs anything? Tho funny thing is that a good sold player eats jedi players even with their 1/3 lives. The most important part of winning in this game is picking a class and a build that best suits to counter the enemy's setup. Many times I have to adjust and play something completely different class and build since the enemy team has something that counters what I was playing before, but what in other instances has the potential to destroy the enemy team.

Gunners have to jump through hoops to get kills on saberists, meanwhile Sith can mow through my team because W+M1. much skill

saberist and gunners just work very differently and comparing them in this way makes no sense. I could also make a point such as "Saberists have to run such long distances to finally catch and kill an enemy while gunners can do it from infinitely far away".

 

[PuNk]

This isn't a game where you can balance all classes 1v1, it's just not possible. Gargos gave you good examples. And no your point about guns having a much harder time of killing saberists can work both ways. Saberist still has to cover a lot of ground to even get a chance at killing a gunner, while the other can shoot him from a distance, drain his FP and then flinch him or knock him down to finish him off. It all depends on player skill, not class, from my experience. As a gunner I get killed by saberists that are more skilled than me, but kill saberists that aren't. Simple as that.

 

[Ornlu]

As someone who exclusively plays gunners, git gud. Mixup your movement to bait jedi into wasting FP, use primary fire or your pistol when they’re far away to be more efficient, stick with teammates and surround them, use flamethrowers and blobs, have someone knock them down while you shoot them, etc. There are so many ways to beat jedi and it mostly comes down to skill and class picks. Mando, clone, and ARC are amazing at beating jedi/sith. Personally I don’t even bother with blobs, I just take a minigun and run circles around them while mowing them down. Saberists are strong in 1v1s, so don’t get caught and use your head. Lightning barely does damage and clones can just run away while it’s active.
Grip is pretty stupid though, that’s the one thing I agree on. It’s mostly used for easy teamkills in spawn or to waste time at the end of a round when there’s one gunner left. It needs to be reworked because it’s just not fun or good for the game.

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

The issue is there is no real consistent system in place for Jedi vs Gunner. It boils down to "I hope he doesn't hit me" and the Jedi gets the advantage of having more than one mistake available to them. Gunning in MB2 is highly inconsistent due to how fast the acceleration and movement classes get, and how slow the projectiles are. Effectively making it a guessing game of whether or not you hit them even in point blank.

If aiming was 100% consistent, then Jedi would be at a severe disadvantage with the flinch system, almost unwinnable. However because it isn't, then Jedi get to run around like hyperactive cats and dodge shots. This isn't skill.

What is skill is a gunner dodging a swing, or using his tools to his advantage properly. That's about it, and those things just take experience.