general feedback thread

[avnas]

i've been playing this mod for a week or so now, i thought i'd offer some feedback on my gameplay experience from multiplayer, here are some things i think could be changed, should be added, or aren't right. if i say "should" i'm saying "it'd be cool if"

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saber throw - it's a pain to land a throw and it only does 35 damage when you do hit. either there needs to be more ultility for the saber throw (like how vader collapsed a platform in ROTJ) or it just needs to be more devastating against non-blockers. i'm not asking for battlefront 2 saber spam, but at least let me kill a stormtrooper. it also seems like 2x sabers should be able to block with the remaining saber.

general extra skills for jedi/sith - mind trick is great, but it doesn't really make sense that only jedi can mind trick. while i'm aware this is a mod balance choice, it leads to some unbalanced situations for the dark side users, where most of their team can just get blindsided - where sith get no such opportunity against clones so to speak.
speed is fun, but again it makes no sense the sith can't use it. the jedi only having mind trick is fair enough, but speed? what about sheev and his spinning scream? - it's a lot like the lunging jump attack speed 3 can do. i'd give sith the ability to scream lunge attack if they take lightning 3 so this ability can stay in the jedi class.
grip is amusing, but it's not really very useful and it's generally only used for 1v1 force whoring. compared to mind trick it's a bit of a gimmick. i'd replace it entirely with sith scream lunge skill because grip is basicly just push. at the same time, it doesn't really make sense only sith can use it. jedi throw clones about plenty... a team version of grip would be cool, so you can throw clones across large jumps. also, if you can use grip while blocking, why can't you push and use other powers? it'd be nice to be able to use a well aimed grip to pick a grenade or rocket out of the air.
lightning is great, but maybe it should drain block a bit more than it does. maybe give a force jedi the opportunity to absorb it like yoda does.
basicly i think sith should be as acrobatic as jedi can be, if not more so.

clones aren't really balanced. their concussive shot should be made the same as ion shot so it doesn't have unlimited power. they should be the same as stormtroopers really. why would older technology be that much better?

bounty hunters should get the same acrobatics as arc troopers, but their sniper rifles should be only as effective as arc troopers. arc troopers pistols shot damage should be reduced but their pistol rate of fire increased.

3 spawn soldiers should be more susceptible to longer ranged push. they can already totally suppress a jedi or sith with constant fire, and they get 3 lives where a jedi doesn't. trying to push in a lot of situations is suicide against some soldiers, and you're only likely to get one unless you're a sneaky sith with lightning.
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i have very few comments on the saber system. it's pretty much perfect, though there could be some additions in variety and hilt advantage, and one observation, which i'll start with. it's too easy to knock people down. hitting should have a smaller chance to actually knock down but a very high chance to knock back.

i'd add reverse saber style in single and 2x versions at light 3, like starkiller's style. could just be implimented on two handed dual sabers with one blade turned off.

i'd add a more acrobatic alternative style for dual sabers. i might be able to get animations for this.

i'd add lightsaber pikes at heavy 3, like the royal guards from TFU use.

i'd make angled hilts have different properties to standard hilts, explanation in path to destruction

i'd make spinning the camera while swinging give the opportunity to hit more than once, but if you spin around you expose your back and make it harder to block the next swing

i don't like that wallrunning and wallsitting drain BP. it'd be cool if you could hang/grab a ledge and climb up as well as just a flat wall.

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silly but serious

is there a way to add a hutt character? a hutt jedi would make the game great. you can do the animations by just sticking the legs together, then you strap on a hutt model to one leg.

can we get yoda's sabers? or the ability to change saber length? smaller sabers swing faster but larger sabers swing longer

are magnaguards out of the question?

can we get helicopter sabers?

 

[avnas]

grip uses less FP than push so you can outspam push with grip. IE if somebody constant grips you, and you push to counter it, you lose from getting worn down

 

[CC-1119 'Appo']

grip uses less FP than push so you can outspam push with grip. IE if somebody constant grips you, and you push to counter it, you lose from getting worn down

Push forward and attack, grip will only 'outspam' push in a fight between bad players or with gunner support, at which point the gunners could probably handle the jedi if the sith just blocks him. Grip requires you to force focus unless your enemy's force points are low enough so you're pretty much unable to do it as long as the enemy even just hits you once.

Grip ATM is more of a counter-camp play, it forces the jedi to go somewhat offensive in order to counter, alternatively, use any gunner. Spamming shots at a sith that is trying to grip you is a great way to drain FP if not outright kill them as they take more FP dmg trying to dodge your shots, or get worn down by continuous fire.

 

[----Kas----]

if you fucks listen to what i'm saying, i said i ALREADY have a few hundred hours experience, you fucks just don't think to explain anything ingame.

i was told cyan had a disarm perk ingame, so your shitty tooltips are confusing most of your playerbase.

4 days have a hundred hours FYI

your autism explained:


"From the above, it looks like Blue is the best defensive stance and Red the worst. In truth however, because of the red PB perk, someone who can PB well can make Red a very strong defensive stance. Blue on the other hand, is an aggressive stance by nature because of the flurry of fast attacks. If I were to pick the stance with the strongest defensive playstyle, it would be White style aka Staff, because of the Mblock perk. More on individual styles and perks later"

this is like, nearly word-for-word what i said about these three styles. perfect blocking is nice with red.

1. I don't like your attitude. Do not tell me you've learned dueling through videos in a month. Also saying that this saber system is perfect is total bullshit. The reason there are no specific guides at the moment is that the system is in the transition stage and it is going to be changed in the near future. Three or four weeks ago there was open BETA 1.4.5 released. Did you even play it?

2. You say there should be a guide with all combos etc. There should be a guide that would cover all of the basics and mechanics, and some good souls already told us they are going to do it. But should combos and other advanced stuff you probably don't have idea about at the moment be explained? Or should be the useful saber/force configurations for open made public? I think the answer is no. You should be provided with the basics and then discover the rest or ask/observe others. Or are you too lazy to check things out?

3. When it comes to grip part. If you get gripped in the first place, it's your fault and if you screw up again (you don't push/pull/dodge) you should die. I usually use grip to kill ''i've been playing for a month and wanna be jedi'' guys quickly, as in open mode there is no time for dueling. And no, mb2_dotf is not the only map out there.

4. EA makes games for masses. They dumb things down so the typical Johnny can play his beloved game in the weekends without much brain effort. SW:ToR is a good example here. (Sorry Johnny, no offense) MB2 is not for masses.

5. How can your opinions be taken seriously if you do not even care about using capital letters when you should? And now after posting your ideas, you were criticized (for a good reason) you insult the community. Feedback is essential of course, but giving bad ideas and crying if other players do not agree with them is just, I don't know... silly?

 

[----Kas----]

grip uses less FP than push so you can outspam push with grip. IE if somebody constant grips you, and you push to counter it, you lose from getting worn down

You have just proven you have no idea how to counter a grip. Allowing someone to grip you is like being half dead already.

 

[SK5]

By saying that "red is good for pb as i said" you are wrong, again. Red doesnt have a pb perk anymore, blue does. This goes to prove that you dont have enough knowledge even if you say so, read the patch notes too Also there is a combo list Special Attacks / Combo List which you probably didnt notice because you were just trying to prove ur bad point.

Calling old players "fucks" makes you just look stupid. We dont want to turn you away from the community but if you cant even have a conversation without insulting, it might be for the better.

 

[avnas]

By saying that "red is good for pb as i said" you are wrong, again. Red doesnt have a pb perk anymore, blue does. This goes to prove that you dont have enough knowledge even if you say so, read the patch notes too Also there is a combo list Special Attacks / Combo List which you probably didnt notice because you were just trying to prove ur bad point.

Calling old players "fucks" makes you just look stupid. We dont want to turn you away from the community but if you cant even have a conversation without insulting, it might be for the better.

wait, so you linked me to an incorrect guide?

i dont understand how i'm supposed to learn what things do if your own guides are wrong. you tell me to read what sev said in a post explaining everything, i did, and that's all changed now???

it doesn't take a team of people to change 1 line of text when you make a change in development.

i don't like your attitudes collectively. i post feedback for a bunch of games, some changes that could only have come from me were applied to tripple A games (SU76 and partisan cloaking in COH2), this isn't the only mod i've given feedback to recently. usually people are happy to have a new opinion even if it is flawed in some way, or just plain silly. if you had a good attitude you'd say what red does now in your post.

if red doesn't do what sev said it does, what does it do? does it do nothing like people said purple does right now? or what? you really can't take an elitist attitude if you don't put any correct guides out.

the game is intuitive enough to play without any explanation except for explaining what things actually do, i even found 90% of the unexplained content with no explanation, but you're all acting like it's impossible to play without a fencing masters degree and an architecture course


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there's nothing i didn't know in the specials combo list

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feedback from ~15 player game.

2 sith are chasing down the last jedi (none of whom are me, i'd just joined in spec cam and came in to see this). one of them just grips the entire time, even though they're already at an advantage.

everyone in the game was complaining about grip at that point. why is it there, i asked? because devs, came the reply.

 

[----Kas----]

Someone close this thread already please.

 

[Lessen]

@avnas
The current documentation and forum/video guides are outdated and that does definitely suck, so I'm with you on that. The in-game library is more-or-less up-to-date, though, I think, so you should definitely give that an ogle if you're wondering about how anything works.

"the game is intuitive enough to play without any explanation except for explaining what things actually do"
I actually really dislike that attitude towards this game because there's a good number of not entirely intuitive but essential mechanics in this game, like IDR, ACM, and even BP drain rules. I get miffed when I see someone play this game without consulting the Library.

I don't mean to disrespect your intelligence by disliking your particular feedback, but, like, with the Third Person thing, I don't think you've realized that the game is designed around the ability to corner peek, which is why I figure you need more hours of play. If you have literally hundreds (I have ~700), why did you say "a week"? It took me much much longer than a week to accumulate legitimate hundreds of hours. Unless you mean you have a solid week's work of hours (168), in which case I would still say that's not enough, lol.

In optimal, teamwork-based play, (which this game seems to be designed around, in spite of its playerbase) Grip can be countered by having a gunner shoot at the Sith. You can only grip if your FP is above 70, and it doesn't take that many shots to drain 30 fp. Stick with your gunners. The way I see it, all of the faction-specific force powers (speed, mt, lightning, grip) are all designed around allowing lone saberists to dominate other lone enemies. That being said, I do think Grip's in a slightly weird place right now but I also think it's kinda underexploited so people are underexperienced in how to counter it.

anyway, use the library, gosh

 

[SeV]

The reason my guide is outdated is not because I am too lazy to update it, but because I don't see 1.4.3 and 1.4.4 as worthy of my attention. Those two builds are literally half-assed crapshoots inferior to 1.4. Even if that build had many faults, it was cohesive, but cohesion was lost in 1.4.3 and 1.4.4. I am waiting for the new system to get pushed out, then there will be an up to date guide along with videos for new players all the way to advanced.

@avnas we've got enough immature kids in this community, but atleast our trolls have a sense of humor. What people are telling you is that MBII is a deep game, not an ez and shallow call of duty or chivalry clone. Have you ever heard of teh donning kruger effect?

 

[avnas]

The reason my guide is outdated is not because I am too lazy to update it, but because I don't see 1.4.3 and 1.4.4 as worthy of my attention. Those two builds are literally half-assed crapshoots inferior to 1.4. Even if that build had many faults, it was cohesive, but cohesion was lost in 1.4.3 and 1.4.4. I am waiting for the new system to get pushed out, then there will be an up to date guide along with videos for new players all the way to advanced.

@avnas we've got enough immature kids in this community, but atleast our trolls have a sense of humor. What people are telling you is that MBII is a deep game, not an ez and shallow call of duty or chivalry clone. Have you ever heard of teh donning kruger effect?

its not your fault, somebody linked it as an uptodate guide, apparently so i could read it and be told i was still wrong.

why did you patch it with a crapshoot? why didn't that stay at beta, then?

why do you assume i'm an immature kid? i don't have a sense of humour because this forum seems to get condescending fast, most of what i've said was because i thought it was bad gameplay, and i didn't even mention how dumb the projectile rifle is. i saw a fight not half an hour ago where all they did was grip-push-grip-push.

you seem to apply more weight to certain information than it perhaps deserves, in that everything including BP was fairly obvious initially. wikipedia says the donnig kruger effect works both ways. perhaps i just find this easy compared to you guys, and if most of the people who play the mod are long-time veterans, i think i'm fairly proficient at everything, especially since i never played JKA.


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on EA: they don't make games for 'the masses' they just make games fast. you're conflating what people want with what people will accept, and it's a bit of a joke if you're saying MB2 is like a diamond only for the chosen few, but then sev describes the last two patches as dog shit.

EAfront even suffers from the same 3p abuse but, y'know it's just part of the game that people sit on corners. i'm also kind of interested to know whether the projectile rifle was put in before or after EA's battlefront. seems familiar right? it's not that it's annoying, which it is, it's just that it works the same. i mean if we're going back to that "it's not an arcade game waah" (even though it's actually set up like an arcade game) it seems strange there are design features straight out of an arcade game.

cornerpeeking is a dumb mechanic and it always will be, most 3pp games spend significant time overcoming the same predictable types of situations it forces people into, as opposed to a fight or flight upon an actual peek. do you really think the sort of DAYZ spinning around on corners while invisible to your enemy is better gameplay than actual peeking?

i guess you can't have real peeking because of the dumb projectile rifles right?

another critique on how this game isn't deep or that far beyond a SW shooter would be that the power attacks like the purple/staff crouch attacks amongst other special moves are based on a non-combo single click or use key activation, or crouching, while a game like streetfighter would have it be at the end of a specific combo which can be cancelled.


on punctuation: never capitalised forum text, never will.

 

[Lessen]

Have you ever heard of teh donning kruger effect?

i thought it was bad gameplay, and i didn't even mention how dumb the projectile rifle is

cornerpeeking is a dumb mechanic and it always will be

[...]this game isn't deep or that far beyond a SW shooter

One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision

Question your certainty. Certainty is death.

do you really think the sort of DAYZ spinning around on corners while invisible to your enemy is better gameplay than actual peeking?

In the context of the rest of the game: yes, I like it. Jedi exist. Blocking shots exists. Sense exists. This changes things.

this forum seems to get condescending fast

The nature of your critiques is condescending to the entire community.

 

[avnas]

you can't seriously be implying that 1hk items aren't a balance issue you thought of as a team at one point or another. that's a hot button issue that's been heavily debated across nearly every title. implying that i think 1hk items are bad for a game has some innate indication of my abilities as a person is insulting and just wrong.

did you ever see a sand person hit anyone with one of those things? and do you think it's an indication of their combat effectiveness in-universe compared to blasters that the only people who use them are mentally handicapped desert tribesmen?

 

[Sammy]

should hook up with Achilles. You both would get along great.

 

[----Kas----]

The amount of crap you are trying to impose is so overwhelming that I am surprised I managed to read it all and post the answer. Just stop, or find other game really. Or both, whatever.

 

[avnas]

The amount of crap you are trying to impose is so overwhelming that I am surprised I managed to read it all and post the answer. Just stop, or find other game really. Or both, whatever.

i'm amazed you've never had a discussion about ranged instant frags

 

[TadekRaeod]

you can't seriously be implying that 1hk items aren't a balance issue you thought of as a team at one point or another. that's a hot button issue that's been heavily debated across nearly every title. implying that i think 1hk items are bad for a game has some innate indication of my abilities as a person is insulting and just wrong.

If you're talking about projectile rifles,they don't always 1 hit kill.ARCs and Mandalorians can,at full armor,resist those shots(with little hp and armor remaining,but still).

 

[Lessen]

i'm amazed you've never had a discussion about ranged instant frags

Jedi exist. Jedi exist. Jedi exist. Jedi exist.

This affects balance. This affects balance. This affects balance. This affects balance.

The balance of a corner-peeking, instant-kill ranged attack is strongly affected by the central existence of a class that can detect people through walls and block shots.

The balance of a corner-peeking, instant-kill ranged attack is strongly affected by the central existence of a class that can detect people through walls and block shots.

The balance of a corner-peeking, instant-kill ranged attack is strongly affected by the central existence of a class that can detect people through walls and block shots.

The balance of a corner-peeking, instant-kill ranged attack is strongly affected by the central existence of a class that can detect people through walls and block shots.

 

[SK5]

@avnas I said you should read the patch notes too, incase guides havent been updated.

 

[Lessen]

Having to trace through all the patch notes in order to deduce what has and hasn't changed is a big pain in the ass though. Maybe your best bet for up-to-date information right now is to read the in-game Library and then compare/contrast it with just the most recent patch notes to see if it's up-to-date and if there's any information present in one spot but not the other.

 

[Katapultman]

I've viewed this thread for quite a while and have come to the conclusion that many others have:You just cannot compare MB2 to your standart go-lucky FPS.Now,I may not be the most experienced player in the game,but I have player for a while(420 hours) and I think that a lot of your accusations on the core mechanics of the game are blatantly dull.IMO these mechanics make the game a lot more enjoyable(that's my inner sniper talking),but still without corner peeking we would be stuck to a camera that might drain my sanity and make peeking extremely risky.That,for a lot of players would ruin the entirety of the game,because(atleast for me),MB2 would lose it's uniqueness.

And as another person stated,that 3p camera ''fix'' would mess up dueling A WHOLE lot.And about the ''outdated guides'' I don't know if it's that much of a task to simply ask a player all the perks of the saber styles.Eventually,you might find one who will help ya.


Until then,I'll be watching this thread until the most likely event of it being closed