Gameplay Direction Post 1.4.3

Gameplay Direction Post 1.4.3​

Hi Guys, I am Hexodious - In the last few weeks I've taken over as Gameplay Lead for Moviebattles II and its occured to me that we've never actually told you where we are headed or why we make specific changes in regards to gameplay. I'd like to use this as an opportunity to change that for us as a team to be more transparent moving forwards as we look to improve the game throughout future patches. This will also allow you to know what we are looking to change, and what kind of feedback we are looking for.

In 1.4.4 we are looking to freeze a solid core for Jedi/Sith in place so we won't have to touch these mechanics for at least a few major patches - This includes: Saber vs Saber, Saber vs Gun and Force Regeneration. I've been looking at a lot of the feedback we've received for 1.4.3 as well as playing a lot of Jedi/Sith in this build and given everyone's experience with 1.4.3, we want to improve on the mechanics that were introduced to make them smoother and a lot more engaging. The goal for Jedi/Sith is to improve their staying power while reducing their ability to retreat while under pressure. 1.4.3's regeneration mechanic did allow this to some extent but was too punishing for players who were trying to support their team.

Below I will break down the core changes we are exploring for 1.4.4.
Please note all of the below is subject to change before release.

FP Regeneration and Drains
Based on 1.4.3's feedback we will be tweaking the FP Regeneration mechanics so that you don't have to worry about holding block, in fact we encourage it.

We will still have 3 states of FP Drain:

• Defenseless (Saber Down/Melee/Idle/Meditate): Base FP Drains for weapons.
• Autoblock (Running): Increased FP Drains for weapons.
• Block: Greatly Decreased FP Drains for weapons.

And there will still be 4 states of FP Regeneration, but we have modified them slightly:

• Meditate:
  • FP Regeneration: Highest, Transition: Ramps up over time, Restrictions: Stationary.
• Defenseless (Saber Down/Melee/Idle):
  • FP Regeneration: Base, Transition: Ramps up over time, Restrictions: Can't Block.
• Defending (Autoblock/Holding Block):
  • FP Regeneration: Slightly lower than base, Transition: Instant.,Restrictions: None.
• Deflecting (Actively Being Shot):
  • FP Regeneration: Greatly lower than base, Transition: Instant Debuff, Duration: 3 seconds (duration can be refreshed each shot, and FP Bar's hue is darkened to indicate debuff is present), Restrictions: Only applies while holding Block.

This combination of drains and states allow us to still have the benefits of really low FP Drains while blocking but doesn't needlessly punish you for holding block while you are not being shot at, whether you are dueling the enemy saberists or supporting your back line. We haven't got the numbers quite in place yet, but after initial testing this feels much smoother and allows the Jedi to have much more freedom while still pushing towards a more active responsibility to manage their FP.



Sense
Sense is a highly debated force power, many would like the power removed completely while others see it as a staple ability that should not be touched. Based on the feedback we've seen we have decided to keep the ability largely similar to how it is, but adjusting how its activated and the durations. In 1.4.4 Sense will tie more into the FP management direction we want to see Jedi's moving towards by using a similar mechanic to Force Speed, another toggled ability but where the duration is solely based on your remaining FP pool.

• Rank 1: Activation Cost: 15FP, Tick Cost: 5FP, 20FP grants you 2s of Sense (equal to the current implementation, but you can have it on for longer if you wish to spend more FP).
• Rank 2: Activation Cost: 10FP, Tick Cost: 5FP, 20FP grants you 3s of Sense (an increase over the current implementation, and you can still choose to have it on longer if you wish to spend more FP).
• Rank 3: Activation Cost: 5FP, Tick Cost: 5FP, 20FP grants you 4s of Sense (a large decrease over the current implementation, but you can still choose to have it on longer if you wish to spend more FP).

These changes allow sense to still be used as an information gathering tool, but encourages smart use of the ability only having it on for as long as you need. Having sense on for a long time while setting up that ambush will leave you starved for FP, greatly increasing the enemy's chance to counter you.


Wall-grab
This ability is a real life-saver while moving around a map and dropping to lower levels, especially on maps like Deathstar. But there are certain players who like to use its ability to hang onto walls forever, often in unreachable locations that cause it to be used in ways we do not intend or to setup lengthy ambushes. As such, the new wall-grab mechanics will actively drain FP slowly while holding onto a wall, automatically drops you upon reaching 0 FP. Also, wall-grab can no longer be used to regenerate FP after bunny hopping.

These changes will still allow the ability to be used as a safe-fall but should prevent poorly planned ambushes. Players will need to better manage their FP pools by choosing the right moment to setup an ambush.


Saber Perks
We've been here before. While Saber vs Saber perks offer a nice diversity between the styles the Saber vs Gun perks adversely change the gameplay dynamics we'd like to see during Saber vs Gun fights. For this reason Saber vs Gun perks won't be included in future builds. Expect refinements to the Saber System and updated Saber vs Saber perks in 1.4.4.


Deflect
This is another ability that greatly benefits from the reduced Block drains and as such we've made some tweaks while updating the mechanics to be less ping dependent. In 1.4.3 Cyan had the ability to deflect by simply holding attack while blocking, this allowed the player to focus entirely on aiming but was too powerful with continuous FP regeneration (even at slow speeds). We liked the quality of life this provided and have applied it to all ranks of deflect (with the Cyan deflect perk being removed). Deflect is in all cases activated by holding attack while blocking and pauses FP regeneration.

• Rank 1: Rapidly Drains FP while held, Cannot be used inside IDR.
• Rank 2: Slowly Drains FP while held, Can be used inside IDR, Cannot be used inside Flinch range.
• Rank 3: Does not Drain FP while held, Can be used inside IDR, Cannot be used inside Flinch range.

Deflecting fits the Jedi fantasy perfectly and gives them a great way to support allies at range beyond push and sense. Now the Jedi must make an active choice to pause their FP regeneration completely in order to reflect shots at the enemy. This still makes Jedi want to wisely time their Deflects as holding it down during a full barrage will quickly deplete your FP pool, but is much more friendly for players of higher ping. We didn't like how in previous builds deflect could be used to facehug someone to death, and while this issue still remains in the form of random deflects, we are able to minimize it greatly.


What about Gunners?

We are mostly happy with the way a lot of the gun classes work. While there are a few things we'd like to look at *cough* SBD *cough* the following are being changed in 1.4.4:

Projectile Rifle
The initial reason behind the Projectile Rifle FP change was to allow Jedi to survive a pop snipe from around a corner, but pop sniping was very fun to do. In reflection of this we've decided to bring back the protection for running Jedi outside of IDR and allow shot-gun snipes to exist vs running Jedi only. A blocking Jedi will be able to protect against a sniper rifle at any range.

• FP Drain Inside IDR while running: Uncapped.
• FP Drain Outside IDR while running: 40.
• FP Drain Inside IDR while blocking <40.

ARC Westar M5
The ammo on this thing has been too low for too long, we heard you. We are increasing the max ammo capacity of the Westar M5 to be inline with other weapons of its type.

• Ammo 1: From 240 > 360.
• Ammo 2: From 360 > 480.
• Ammo 3: From 480 > 600.

This change is very self-explanatory, we feel that ARCs are in a good place at the moment and are very versatile. But the extremely low ammo count was causing too many issues - especially on higher population servers, where the ARC felt like he couldn't provide supporting cover.

Dodge
While the new dodge mechanic does what we want it to, it feels a bit too cumbersome by forcing you into a movement state based on rank and having to hold a button at the same time. We want Dodge to be used to get through chokepoints and suppressed areas, but not to let you tank huge amounts of shots for free. We also thought it was too hard to glance at your Dodge Points while they were being drawn as small numbers and have re-introduced the Dodge Bar.

In all cases, dodge is activated by holding it and has no movement restrictions.It also cannot be used while scoped.

• Rank 1: Cost: A full bar drains over 1 second. Cannot be used up close.
• Rank 2: Cost: A full bar drains over 2 second. Cannot be used up close.
• Rank 3: Cost: A full bar drains over 3 second. Can be used fairly close.

These changes still allow Dodge to be use as a cover breaker while requiring a manual activation to complete. We wanted to keep the current Disruptors(Stationary/Hitscan) vs Projectile(Mobile/Pop-snipe) balance in Sniper vs Sniper engagements but wanted to still provide an alternative option to fight back. Dodge will allow you break the usual corner-play and press the offensive or fallback into cover while you are being shot at. We are still exploring the Hold mechanic over a form of Toggle, similar to what we've introduced for Sense.

Dash
Bringing dodge into a more manual ability was causing conflicts with Dash and Dodge Points. We want players to be able to Dash freely and not to worry about their remaining Dodge Points, at the same time we didn't like the gameplay double dashing in a row would cause skewing balance in the favour of the Hero. Dash has been changed as follows:

• Rank 1:
  • Dashes a short distance in the current movement direction.
  • 2.5s cool-down.
  • Doesn't share a cool-down with Melee moves.
  • Same activation.
  • Unlimited uses.
• Rank 2:
  • Dodges any incoming blasters for the duration of the dash animation.

The cool-down still allows Dash to be used as an intended quick escape or combat positioning tool but prevents double Dashing to escape instances where you may poorly used the ability. At the same time we didn't want to interrupt fun combos such as Dash into Flying Kick, similar to how Blob and Flying Kick function as independent cool-downs.



Final Thoughts

We are excited to get these changes out to you as soon as possible and are committed to continuing progress of the game. The above items are unlikely to change bar number tweaks, but now that we've been able to give you an insight into the direction we are taking we would love to hear back from you on new features, weapons, abilities and mechanics you'd love to see included into Movie Battles II in future builds following 1.4.4.

 

[Jediknight Fou]

Deflect
We didn't like how in previous builds deflect could be used to facehug someone to death, and while this issue still remains in the form of random deflects, we are able to minimize it greatly.

So gunners can still facehug you and spam their blasters without disadvantage. *sigh*

Projectile Rifle
and allow shot-gun snipes to exist

Was happy this shit was gone, well if ppl cry loud enough its heard at least if you are gunner.

These changes in my opinion don't make saberists less noob-friendly, it's straight up saying "f*ck off newbs*. It must be infuriating for newbs to get absolutely destroyed ALL the time without understanding why because they don't know the game mechanics, weapons, tactics and so on. This update requires you to KNOW more things and drastically reduces the room for skill regarding movements.

There is no undertanding why.
The reason you get destroyed as saberist is because shitmechanics like flinch and other unbalanced stuff.
And what new ppl do you mean?
The first half people which came for saber are leaving if they realize how unbalanced this game is in saber vs gunner and the other half which is not annoyed stays on duel server.
In parody battles 2 is no skill, at least not since 1.4.
Since then this mod digs its own grave, too.

From what I got from your posts Stassin, I agree with Achilles: you don't consider other people's opinions.

Agree, but nothing new here, everyone knows that.

Working on a version that will last for a longer time would allow for finer tweaking that results, in my opinion, in a more enjoyable and more populated game. With balance gradually improving, it makes the game less frustrating and with the versions changing less often, people don't need to go through learning the game all over again.

I sadly doubt that will ever happen.

 

[DaloLorn]

Wall of text, wall of text, wall of text, and virtually nothing new.

 

[Darth Pujge]

@VongsA newbie jedi, versus a newbie gunner ? Will the gunner/clone hit any of his blobs, will he even hit 1/10 of his blaster shots ? Will he even walk ? These are the things you fail to consider,

In my opinion it's really easy, especially when you realize how helpful walking and crouching is and that your shots stop lightsaber attacks. I've played as a clone trooper for maybe 30-40 minutes and I was doing surprisingly well, in fact I managed to even got a positive K/D from killing sith! C:

Same goes with the commander class which I've played a bit more than the clone but most of that was just spamming the "LOOK, over there!" taunt that the scout trooper gets. The only time I remember fighting a jedi as a commander when playing seriously was when I got forced into a narrow space between two jedi so I crouched and started firing at one of them and managed to kill him since all of his swings got stopped, and the other one was trying to deal with a super battle droid. Other gunners are a lot scarier than jedi and sith in my opinion, especially since my aim is really bad so they'll just out-gun me and shoot me in the face or something. :C

(Keep in mind these were against newbie jedi, competent jedi kill me easily.)

 

[S o l d i e r]

I still want this. No exact position as it only gives periodic position during pulse, doesn't give away class information, animation state, possible weaponry.

I totally agree with this one for Sense. Besides that, this should also be done to it in my opinion:

I think the only thing that should be done to Sense is reduce its range considerably. As it is right now, you can literally see the whole map with it. Reducing its range would give a choice to the "sensed" to keep a distance from the saberist in order not to be revealed. It would also add a valuable defensive strategic aspect against it. I also don't understand why Sense 3 has dodge, because saberists already have a nearly impenetrable defense against gun fire, and giving them dodge is just stacking skills and overpowering Sense.

Sense does kill stealth gameplay, but there are also other things that kill it. Those things are cross-team spectate, cross-team chat, and spectate hud show. I think there is an option to remove both cross-team spectate and spectate hud show, and server admins should be encouraged to disable them. I'm not sure if cross-team chat can be disabled, but if it can't, that option should be added too, and server admins should be encouraged to use that option too. These three things (cross-team chat, cross-team spectate and spectate hud show) should maybe be disabled for good too, like they did in World of Tanks, but I'm not sure if players would agree with removing the cross-team chat. These are the reasons for which cross-team chat was disabled in WoT, and they can also be applied to MB2:

"The main purpose of the Battle Chat is for coordinating the actions of you and your allies. Thus, the interaction between players is crucial to the battle's outcome. If a team coordinates during battle, they are likely to win. However, at the same time, cross-team communication can be used as a way to abuse or insult players."

"We have received quite a bit of community feedback that the chat between teams during games has been a source of not only abusive language, but also of grieving and cheating. The cross-team Chat often becomes too emotional and provocative, or is used to reveal the position of your team to opponents. To prevent this, we’ve decided to disable the cross-team Battle Chat in all battle types except Team Training."

 

[olor]

On the topic of dodge, can you not tie the duration 'resource' with the 'resource' used up to actually dodge the shots? One of the most frustrating things in this game is getting popsniped from behind a corner with less than a second (or with packetloss/ping issues, not even any amount of time) of time to react. (And you have to turn a corner somehow if you're attacking) It sucks if you get sniped down with dodge 3 up because you started holding it 0.25 secs too early and was missing 5 dodge points to dodge the snipe.

 

[S o l d i e r]

By the way, I suggest adding the /resetscore option, and fixing that lag that happens when someone connects, if it can be fixed.

 

[Damn Polak]

completely and utterly

nice meme

ctf_ns_streets (...) adapt it to MB2

it would only make sense if mb2 allowed strafejumping, running through these levels with soldier speed waiting to get sniped can't be fun
also, imagine all these push/repulse spammers hoping for ez falling kills due to map design

I find myself just sitting, waiting for my team to push so i can also push to find more cover so i wont die immediatly from a hidden proj that will peek out of no where and blast me into another galaxy

work on your movement; with enough strafing, crouching and melee-grab-sliding you can bait snipers to fire and miss, then supress them ezl

Draining a (possibly) full clip of ammo via pulse nade

how unlucky can you get to forget switching to melee as soon as the emp is thrown

To tackle the SBD issue I suggest making the exposed middle part of its body, the abdomen, its weakpoint

what if someone can fire sbd blaster while in cover exposing only his right arm

Weapon customisation yeaaaaaaaaaah
While we're at it, let's go COD style and add emotes
while we're at it, let's start skin market for e-11's and t21's starting at £300
Solving donation problems in seconds

you're a fucking genius, you know that?

 

[DaloLorn]

@S o l d i e r You forget that spectators can move around (relatively) freely. One doesn't need cross-team spectating to spy on people.

 

[CC-1119 'Appo']

what if someone can fire sbd blaster while in cover exposing only his right arm

That means they found excellent cover, so you fire at them while strafing as they have to remain still and, likely, crouched in order to hide their abdomen from weapons fire.


Also, not related to SBD but can we get a look at Deka's durability? maybe tone that down at range unless you lock down into place because 700 shield and 400 hp is painful AF. to go up against, basically the only real use the EMPs have in MB2 is countering a max durability deka.

 

[S o l d i e r]

it would only make sense if mb2 allowed strafejumping, running through these levels with soldier speed waiting to get sniped can't be fun
also, imagine all these push/repulse spammers hoping for ez falling kills due to map design

I had that in mind. That's why I said adapt it to MB2. They don't have to use the exact map or make only little changes, they can change whatever they want to make it suitable for MB2.

what if someone can fire sbd blaster while in cover exposing only his right arm

That tactic is pretty limiting by itself and it cannot be used always. You can't shoot everywhere in that position, your maneuverability, line and radius of fire is pretty limited, and it is easy to find cover against an SBD using that, or change your position or flank the SBD to get a better shot at him. That arm tactic was used before too to hide the body and make you a smaller and harder target to hit. The abdomen weakpoint just adds a more prominent role for that tactic, so I see no problem with that.

@S o l d i e r You forget that spectators can move around (relatively) freely. One doesn't need cross-team spectating to spy on people.

Yes, I forgot that, maybe also add an option to disable free-roam spectating. If you want to look at maps you can do it in single player.

 

[Fang]

you're a fucking genius, you know that?

@Damn Polak Glad someone acknowledges my extra chromosome

On another note, can I have cheater next to my name so I can shut down kids by them thinking I'm cheating when I'm actually good please

 

[DaloLorn]

More likely, look at battles from a third-person perspective.

 

[S o l d i e r]

More likely, look at battles from a third-person perspective.

I didn't say disable spectating completely, only free-roam spectating.

 

[Gumba]

I'm actually good

heh good one

 

[Fang]

thanks for agreeing

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

So first of all, I need to get my obligatory Clones-Are-Cancer message out of the way,

Clones are cancer, and should be reworked.

There we go, now on to my points.

1) FP Regen should be increased when the Jedi has the ability to focus, that should be when he is doing the *least* amount of activities. Standing still/sitting should offer the most FP, blocking should offer high FP regen, running should offer low FP regen. I believe this would make logical sense, no? This would make it so the Jedi can take refuge in BLOCKING rather than running away and hoping not to get shot.

2) Flinch, I feel, should work on *all* classes, with the exception of Deka/SBD, once you get past someone's armor. Without armor, people should be getting flinched with torso/head shots, this would also make deflect more useful for flinching a gunner *before* swinging. HOWEVER, ALL of the weapons in MB2 would need tweaking, in the sense that everything in MB2 fires way too god damned fast.

3) Strafing needs to be tweaked, of course, and be as slow as walking backwards. This would make the game less of a guessing strafe-match like CS;Go+Lag.

4) Sniper weapons, should require the user to steady their aim before firing by holding still for a couple of seconds. The proj rifle should also be pulled off Hero/BH, and given to a dedicated sniper class that doesn't have *everything*. Such as Commando, which could pick a sniper/cloak, or sword/e-11/mobility, etc. At the moment, everything in open eventually devolves into Sniper spam, or clone/sbd spam.

5) Skill should be the most important aspect, but it should also be *obvious*. A god-tier Jedi should be capable of running down a hallway, and slaughtering 5-6 average gunners/jedi, and a god-tier gunner should be able to slaughter several other jedi/gunners. One of the factors that restricts this, is the lack of healing. The best Jedi/Sith/Gunners in the universe will get whittled down to death by guaranteed damage abilities, that is stupid. Another issue is this weird almost-rock-paper-scissors attitude regarding classes 'Oh BH is supposed to counter Jedi' when BH literally counters *everything*, EVERYTHING SHOULD COUNTER EVERYTHING IF PLAYED WELL ENOUGH, but that isn't the case. As a soldier, if a Wookiee hides around a corner, and you walk within 15 feet, you're dead, no matter how skilled you are. Skill > Team in Star Wars. However, currently, you don't use skill to kill average-level players, you use gimmicks, such as hiding behind corners, or sense+speed+mindtrick combos, or lightning. Simply because those gimmick-strategies are more reliable against players that don't know them, than actual skill.

6) The skill ceiling needs to be raised for gunners/jedi, with the incorporation of advanced abilities, such as roll cancels, insta-katas, and the like. The skill ceiling atm for open, I feel, is too low. There isn't much a hyper good player can do at a certain point, except not make mistakes.

7) More build variety I think for players that want to focus different roles should be a thing. At the moment, everything feels so god damned shoe-horned, like I *HAVE* to play support Jedi, or I *HAVE* to play this specific way with soldier... it is boring.

 

[Damn Polak]

Strafing needs to be tweaked, of course, and be as slow as walking backwards

you gotta be fucking kidding me

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

So Polak, you like everything in MB2 relating to blaster fire to be guessing matches? Which way will he strafe? I'm assuming you like a Jedi running around you? Or do you not play Soldier, which is incredibly slow, and can't strafe at Mach II.

There is utterly no reason for disliking a strafe change, except 'I use a lot of Hero/BH, and I enjoy running side ways as fast as I run forwards because those pitiful noob plebs can't hit me'

 

[Damn Polak]

there's always some spraying & praying, but reducing maximum strafing speed is so srs change to the game...
basically it would mean i can no longer dodge these WA swings while returning fire

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

But the Jedi would no longer be able to dodge your shots as easily, either.