Dev ignorance boogaloo

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2cwldys

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AaronAaron

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Open mode is dead. Duel mode sucks.

Everything has gone downhill in the last 4 years.

Mace has to go. This is the truth. Defiant is scared of Mace.

Mace is the same guy who decided to bring back the bad version of classic dotf to spite everyone who wanted classicb instead of the version he made.

Mace banned me from the MBII Discord and kicked me from the beta team (I was the top beta tester for duel mode #FACT) for saying a made up word. "Ukreen"

Get rid of Mace, and Defiant please step down.

There aren't many options left at this point.
 
Posts
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Open mode is dead. Duel mode sucks.

Everything has gone downhill in the last 4 years.

Mace has to go. This is the truth. Defiant is scared of Mace.

Mace is the same guy who decided to bring back the bad version of classic dotf to spite everyone who wanted classicb instead of the version he made.

Mace banned me from the MBII Discord and kicked me from the beta team (I was the top beta tester for duel mode #FACT) for saying a made up word. "Ukreen"

Get rid of Mace, and Defiant please step down.

There aren't many options left at this point.
Hi, Aaron. For saying this you have earned +2 warning points for disputing moderation.
 

Defiant

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Now that people have had a chance to cool down, I would like to address this and draw a line under this thread. There are two parts to this, the factual side and then I want to talk a little bit about respect. I will then be locking this thread and people can draw their own conclusions. I own each and every one of my decisions and the consequences that follow good or bad. I do not hide these things away or try and play political games unlike some people in the community. I have not and will not attempt to shut down any critisim of myself or the team so long as it is not personal in nature.

Facts
This is my recollection of events related to your GC Supremecy project. The parts from my memory are as falable as any human memory, where possible I will provide you with the evidence and dates.

  • You Start your GC Project
    • 27th January 2019 You ask me to try it - I remember enjoying it but do not have any evidence of this
    • 1.png
  • You Apply to the dev Team - April 8th 2024
    • You ask to join the dev team so that you can make your project officially a part of MBII.
    • You specificly ask for access to test resources to assist you
    • You do not recieve a reply from either myself or any other developer
    • Around this time we are internally struggling to meet our 20th anniversary deadline
    • This is around the time when V1.10.1 was being finalised
    • I have in recent months been working extensively on a Movie Battles II full authentic "gamemode" that involves grand strategy on a galaxy map, inspired akin to our all time favorite 2005 Battlefront, and Empire at War, by Lucasarts.
      I have been recommended by several members of the community to join the development team so my project can be more publicly recognized, better represented, and enjoyed as an addition to the Moviebattles game assets. As well as grow upon existing full authentic skills and learn more alongside producing contributions to the game I have so passionately enjoyed for over eight years.

      My intentions genuinely have been pure with the project, despite the drama in it's earliest stages. Though suffice to say I am 70% of the way complete with a current representation for the existing moviebattles release and I am willing to provide documentation.

      I have done my best to understand full authentic material, with the assistance of FrenZ and John, asking various developers, and eventually joining the beta team.

      ----

      Galactic Conquest has always been a dream which I wanted to bring to the Moviebattles community, but quite frankly didn't have the wisdom or insight into searching how to implement them in the game. The handbook began as a general contribution for honor-based coordination regarding the modification's open gamemode assets. Eventually growing into far more than that with the assistance of MBII John, who has been more than helpful with this project. I would like to join the team to further assist him and learn more of how to bring this project to reality. I am handling all the teamconfigs for neutral factions, generic planet defense, and era-specific factions. With the handbook accommodating up to eight and potentially more eras depending on the creative content surrounding Moviebattles.

      Most of my problems recently has been people making copies, and making modifications to my work with greater outreach. Which is unfortunate. My goal is to continue working with this, provided the team can give it some official backing. I haven't been comfortable working on it too much knowing that anyone can take it and use it as they choose, which it would be amazing if these events can be hosted officially through Moviebattles. Through the position of Community Liason if I cannot be made a developer.

      Here is documentation on the handbook, which will accomodate both Full Authentic and Open gameplay: LINK

      Here is access to the github regarding the project, where non-beta and non-private assets are publicly accessible: LINK

      Here is access to my roadmap for current version changelogs and locations for repositories regarding public contributions: LINK

      ----

      I lack official testing, which it would be wonderful if simultaneously my work can be tested through SVN beta testing, rather than fishing for people in a private discord.

      I take the work I have been working on very seriously, since I was concepting it's earliest stages since 2016. I would like more official endorsing of this project and to fully join the team to work alongside john for FA development. I have a lot to learn, and can provide ANY and ALL examples of my work and their implementations, and how they can be great for the Moviebattles experience. MBII John wishes for me to get all the concept work out of the way, so come May or so, we could potentially see this concept yield further results and contributions. I thank you, if you consider to take the time to read this, and treat it seriously as I do it: for I think all players should enjoy my time and effort into this project. Where I have dealt with large amounts of contemporary jealousy, being removed from entire discords for discussing it, and drama; I honestly would prefer it to stop by landing the hammer on the nail surrounding the project.

      Attached to this post, is a snapshot of all my work so far, so you can test for yourselves or see if it's worthy enough contributions to have somewhat a seat on the team and assist with bringing galactic conquest events to this community. If I can get a reply to this post and some acknowledgement I'll provide the hashed password using mega.nz.
      LINK

      Thank you!
  • May 15th 2024 - You ask me to push GC through Launcher as an Open beta
    • This is less than one week before the 20th Anniversary Open Beta Began
    • As an internal beta tester you would have been well aware of this
    • 2.png
    • I do not reply to you on discord, I do not recall replying at all.
  • 9th June 2024
    • You ask me to play test GC again
    • This request is sent at 21:43 my time on a Sunday night. I would likely have been otherwise occupied by this time of the evening, but I cannot say for certain.
    • I do not reply
  • 9th August 2024 - You withdraw your developer application
    • This is the first time you express a feeling of not being appreciated
    • You do say that you plan on reapplying in the future
    • [*]I rescind my application to the Moviebattles development team. It has been four months without a reply or acknowledgement, and I will do the favor of revoking the application myself: due to the lack of interest, and appreciation; of taking my efforts towards this mod with deep and serious consideration. Having asked several developers on the progress on this, to reach no meaningful conclusion.

      I will continue to diligently work on my FA projects to be enjoyed by the players of this mod. I will likely re-apply when I have the full understanding of knowing my application can and will be taken more seriously: especially when my very complex and ambitious FA project is finished and ready to be integrated upstream with Moviebattles assets.

      With the advisement of several developers, I have learned how to contribute back to this mod, and will continue to do so. Having contributed to a number of wiki pages, general questions in the discord, and uMad assets. I believe I can do it without having to be a member of this team. After having a clear understanding of the cohesion and team politics going on behind the curtain of this mod. I believe it would be a hinderance in what I would want to achieve, in the independence of the atmosphere and balance of my own projects.

      I have learned much; from creating your own sabers, to incorporating models and managing the in-depth customization of weapons and forcepowers into all corners of Full Authentic. With a lot of study and reference material from the various game assets and legends, it's given me a brilliant understanding of how the depths of modifying siege works so expertly with this mod.

      My project is still going strong, and I have over a hundred members in my discord. With a solid team of testers, kitbashers, contributors, and others in many group chats who are inspired by my work for a chance to add more content to this game, granting common players the spotlight within something new and engaging. Inviting popular names from JKEmpire to tutor new modelers that assist me. The z_zz_mb2_sup_assets.pk3 is nearing close to 100 mb, with over 1000 siege characters and 500 siegeteams. With content reaching from as early as the Eternal Empire, to as late as the Sith-Imperial War. We test regularly everything we create using auto-updater software we created ourselves, using NSIS. What I create, I wish to share with all others as a massive attempt towards giving back to this modification I grew up with and so enjoyed. My intentions as always, has been towards making a better atmosphere for this game and give more fun content and experiences to enjoy. The common atmosphere is so negative, toxic, and disinteresting. I wish to create things remarkably new, replayable, and engaging.

      What I long for is more recognition in what I am attempting to do. I understand the focus on the distribution of the latest patch has taken up a lot of people's time, but I would like and appreciate some serious feedback with inclusivity with my creative interests and visions towards Moviebattles. I have converted a lot of people's negativity, contemporary jealousy, and hate towards me in recent months towards perfecting the ultimate soldier-heavy gamemode for Moviebattles, utilizing the effectiveness and stressing the boundaries that legends has to offer this mod. Really pushing Full Authentic to being a more respected and highly enjoyed mode, which has slowly fallen out of interest despite being the core barebones of this game. Being outright banned due to jealousy across many servers has given me much time to perfect what it is I want to do, that is to give back to this mod. In all seriousness, I do wish to join this team and continue to work on the things I enjoy; but I've not heard back much at all from all fronts towards including my vision in the future of this mod, and I would appreciate more. Thank you.
  • 28th October 2024 - Frenzy Internally proposes that it is time to integrate GC as a new game mode
    • Frenzy specifies that this would be an entirely new gamemode and that you do not want anyone else to be able to run this mode and that there is a server side script controling it.
    • This is my reply to the proposal as it stood
      3.png
  • 30th October 2024 - Following a few days worth of discussions around this between other team members the team's consensus appears to be the following (Note: as this is dev chat I have anonymised the person who said it. It was not me.)
    4.png
  • 30th October 2024 Further discussion follows where the topic of assets for which 2c does not have any copyright claim to comes up. My response to this being an official release with that being the case is as follows. Please note that i say we will use our descretion over the master server ToS and not take any action against it.
    5.png
  • 6th November 2024 - Frenzy privately checks in with me regarding the GC project
    • I have misunderstood his proposal from the 28th of October, thinking that this would need internal resources to implement
    • I appologise for the confusion
    • I propose giving 2c's GC servers official status post integration to properly protect them against master server ToS violations
      8.png
  • 7th November 2024 I reach out the 2c and we have this conversation: Dev ignorance boogaloo
    • I clearly explain to him what becomming an official part of MBII would require on his part, explain what he gains and what he loses.
    • Included in the explaination is that as an official part of the mod, we need to have the source files where we can access them.
    • The response to this is that he wishes to keep the source under his control. This is a rejection of the offer of official integration
      6.png
    • Much later that evening I am asked:
      7.png
    • As integration has already been rejected, I do not reply to this hypothetical.
      • As academic as the answer is now, it would have been to refer back to earlier in the conversation where he would have to give up complete control, however like most mappers see little to no interference this would be the case here
  • Between 8th November and 24th November 2024
    • There is no record I can find of this - This probably happened on a voice chat
    • Frenzy and I work out a way we think will work to release 2c's files as a 3rd party addon in what will eventually become a community contribution programme. 2c's files will be released before the program is set up in order to save him time. We will offer what protection we can for the ToS violating script, but if many people complain we may not have a choice.
    • I am unable to present this immediatly to 2c as he has blocked me. I ask Frenzy to pass the message on.
  • 24th November 2024 Onwards - 2c and I discuss his GC project and my communication short commings in the infamous 'Open is finally dead' thread.
  • 11th December 2024 - I reiterate that the work can be distributed via the upcomming contribution programme and that he will not have any interference from anyone (Please note, the deleted message is Internally priviledge information regarding release plans)
    9.png
    • I go on to clarify that the only restriction will be you wouldnt be able to distribute anything you couldnt post on the forums anyway
      10.png
  • 15th December 2024 - MB2 developers have their scheduled bi-weekly voice meeting
    • This meeting is solely focused on organisational changes and a desire to move to a faster release cadence and a presentation from myself on how we get there.
    • 2c believes we are talking about him. I correct him.
      11.png
    • I believe that we are in a good place to get this work out within the first quater of this year
  • 16th December - Defiant is admitted to hospital with complications following from an Influenza A infection. And this ends any communication I was having with 2c at the time. I do not catch up with my workload in order to get back to looking at GC and the CC pack untill basically now.

Respect for Contributions
I fully accept that my early communication was poor - especially around the time we were trying to get the R20 release out the door. Following the 'Open is finally dead' thread I feel as though I took this on board and improved significantly. Maybe not perfect but better. And I feel as though that is the extent to which I have done anything which could be seen as disrespectful - and if I have made you feel that way I genuinly offer you my sincere appology.

However, At each step along the way you have been asking for something from us, the expectation that because you have made something for MBII that we are somehow obligated to drop everything and prioritise pushing it out for you is clearly unreasonable. We offered to make it official and explained what that would mean for you and your project. You rejected this and confirmed that rejection when you saw what the copyright agreement for MBII developers is - And i respect you so much for that, for saying 'No this isnt what I want for my work'. I have not in anyway said that it is unreasonable for you to reject those terms or suggest that you are making a mistake, instead I have tried to find a solution that we are both happy with. I believed that we had one and it was just the implementation of it that was the issue.

I dont think it is unreasonable to expect the same respect back from you, 2c. I do not see how you can simulatniously be of the opinion that you deserve creative control of your work, whilst expecting us to give up control of our work in order to incoporate yours. We have fully respected your decision not to integrate GC with MB2, and even now the door to submit it as a community contribution will be open to you. I would ask that you respect the MBII Team as a collective - Past and present contributers - to creative control over our own work without creating this "I am being opressed narrative" because we dont want to put our name to a work that we are not allowed to give any input on.
 
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