Why do Heroes get everything a Sniper should not have?

[TwiceDead]

Dash, Dodge and Heal.

I'm not going to make any secret that I thoroughly despise all three and I am heavily biased against them, not as mechanics in and of themselves, but as a package. With all 3 they gain the staying power an assault class should have who's in a constant fire-fight, it seems weird to give it to someone who mostly hangs in the back(Granted, CQC snipes is a very tangible thing in this game).

It seems weird for SNIPERS to get all three of these abilities as all of them encourage and help you keeping your distance and ensure that you thrive there.
Against small blaster-fire, it's no big problem as you can duck behind cover and completely recover, making reckless exposure of yourself as you attempt to snipe targets less punishable. Against snipers, only headshots on you matter, making counter-snipes and sniper-duels lopsided. Should enemies close up on you, you still have the tools to avoid attacks and retreat to a safer position, and even if you don't retreat, you have more mobility than most to last a fight.

If Snipers only had a Sniper and a shitty pistol on their side limiting their effectiveness to long-range, then I could easily understand why they have the tools necessary to increase the gap between them and their foes with ease and ensure they can thrive there. Currently as things are, they have the almighty Pistol 3, which is downright godly compared to a Blaster Rifle, so they hardly fare any worse in a CQC engagement.

It'd make more sense in my mind that snipers get tools to cover their flanks, mines, traps, the sort of things to encourage enemies to keep their distance or approach with caution, but maybe that's not feasible for this games fast-paced gameplay.

Now I am not going to claim that BH's are any worse off (although against Heroes, they kind of are), as they have poison, tracking and TD's on their side. Not to mention the Disruptor. IMO Poison Darts shouldn't be hit-scan, but that's a discussion for another time.

 

[StarWarsGeek]

I think it's more weird that HEROES have a sniper. I've always been a fan of moving the proj rifle to another class on rebs. On the old forums discussions came up multiple times about giving rebel Elite Troopers the proj rifle and Heroes getting rally. I don't really think of most of the characters that the Hero class is supposed to portray as snipers, but most of them are leaders.

 

[Supa]

Help. I double-posted.
EDIT: No delete function? Or am I just being deliberately blind?

You should be able to delete your own posts.

In any case, I don't like that heroes have projectile personally, it makes no sense to me. The fact that all of the abilities heroes have been given do exactly the opposite they were intended to do and complimenting projectile way too well doesn't really help that.

 

[Mr_Oujamaflip]

I don't like snipers much but I do feel heroes should act as a counter sniper hence dodge and whatnot. I think it works.

Alternatively another class could be the sniper for Rebels but who would it suit?

 

[Supa]

Yeah, dodge is fine. Dodge + projectile isn't fine. And to me there is nothing heroic about sniping. I just feel bad.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

We had a discussion some time ago about this and its because there are 2 classes missing.
The rebels are supposed to have a class called mercenary.
He is supposed to be the rebel sniper, Not sure about the other class for empire.

I think we also discussed about what to do with the hero but it was never addressed if there is going to be something done. I think supa will remember thread.

I personally hope they do finish the merc class for rebels.

 

[Puppytine]

There is thread about heroes already:
Dev's team opinion on Hero balance? | Movie Battles II Community
And thread about dash:
Dash reworked | Movie Battles II Community

As sith player, I'm totally ok with heroes, except of sound of sniper rifle; I think it should be much loader (idea inspired by @BigBossBigTeef ).

The funny thing is that there is topic about push not far away, where people trying as hard as they can to prove that push is overpowered and gunners need a counter...

You should be able to delete your own posts.

I can't. The button "delete" is nowhere to be found.

 

[Catlord Meow!]

We had a discussion some time ago about this and its because there are 2 classes missing.
The rebels are supposed to have a class called mercenary.
He is supposed to be the rebel sniper, Not sure about the other class for empire.

I think we also discussed about what to do with the hero but it was never addressed if there is going to be something done. I think supa will remember thread.

I personally hope they do finish the merc class for rebels.

Isn' the bh already a "mercenary"

 

[Supa]

I can't. The button "delete" is nowhere to be found.

Edit that post and the option should be there, if I remember correctly.

 

[Gumba]

Whoever uses dodge in the current build is a fool. It is not worth the points unless you have 3+ godlike disruptor players on the enemy team.

Just change the default hero build to not use dodge.

 

[Mr_Oujamaflip]

Yeah, dodge is fine. Dodge + projectile isn't fine. And to me there is nothing heroic about sniping. I just feel bad.

I'd be pretty happy if all snipers got removed tbh.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

I'd be pretty happy if all snipers got removed tbh.

Snipers are a hard counter against sabers, we need them.

As sith player, I'm totally ok with heroes, except of sound of sniper rifle; I think it should be much loader (idea inspired by @BigBossBigTeef ).

I forgot I suggested to make them louder, I only get sniped by like one player nowadays.

 

[Supa]

I think there need to be snipers, but long range support needs to be a specialized role, not just given out like candy because it can be. It's pretty frustrating when everyone plays sniper because it's effective at long range, but still versatile enough to provide a good fight at medium/close range as well.

 

[Puppytine]

Edit that post and the option should be there, if I remember correctly.

Still can't find it, but you're moderator, you have it anyway, while I'm not.

I'd be pretty happy if all snipers got removed tbh.

You want to nerf push, you want to remove snipers... Anything else you want to remove?
It would pure deterioration of Movie Battles.

I think there need to be snipers, but long range support needs to be a specialized role, not just given out like candy because it can be. It's pretty frustrating when everyone plays sniper because it's effective at long range, but still versatile enough to provide a good fight at medium/close range as well.

So what they can fight at close range? After all, during the round players suppose to die, number of them get lower every minute, and at the end there is only a few members of each team.
If each class would be locked in some specialization, 1 vs 1 scenario would be very predictable and annoying.

 

[TwiceDead]

I'd be pretty happy if all snipers got removed tbh.

I don't want Snipers removed.
I don't like them much myself, but they are part of gameplay now and have a very strong presence in a match, encouraging people to stay on their toes and not bullrush everything. They're basically locking down zones of the map(lack of better word) I just think the DDH package is a little over the top.

As for counter-snipes, to counter-snipe two snipers should face each-other on equal terms to make things fair and not have the scales tip in favor for the other team. The better shot should be the winner, but Dodge doesn't make this fair engagement as Heroes can bodyshot BH's and have done substantial damage without necessarily getting the kill. BH's don't have that luxury, although an argument can be made that the additional 20 armor BH's have doesn't make it fair either, though.

Edit that post and the option should be there, if I remember correctly.

I honestly cannot find it.

There is thread about heroes already:
Dev's team opinion on Hero balance? | Movie Battles II Community
And thread about dash:
Dash reworked | Movie Battles II Community

As sith player, I'm totally ok with heroes, except of sound of sniper rifle; I think it should be much loader (idea inspired by .

I keep forgetting Forums have a search function. My bad.

Louder snipers make sense.

So what they can fight at close range? After all, during the round players suppose to die, number of them get lower every minute, and at the end there is only a few members of each team.
If each class would be locked in some specialization, 1 vs 1 scenario would be very predictable and annoying.

I don't agree with this logic though. If you follow the logic of "Players are supposed to die" you could make all kinds of ludicrous changes. You're supposed to give a player the means to kill and the means to defend himself, within reason.

Besides that, classes are already locked in their own specialization. Mando's get the choice between Westars and their EE-3, same with Arc Troopers with their Rifle or Clone-Pistols. Only rarely do you see either run both, and when they do they most likely don't have the scope function. Soldiers, Clones, SBD's and Jedi are close combat skirmishers, same with Empire ET's with the exception of Rebel ET's Wingun, they are objectively less efficient at range than classes with access to long-range weaponry.

 

[Supa]

So what they can fight at close range? After all, during the round players suppose to die, number of them get lower every minute, and at the end there is only a few members of each team.

I have no problem with heroes being able to fight at close range, I just don't like that they can do both provide long range support and fight up close at the same time. A class that has multiple roles they specialize in, which is in my opinion how each class with the exception of soldier should be developed, is perfectly fine, but to get both simultaneously feels really bad when you aren't playing against them. Hell, it feels bad when you're playing as them.

Too much versatility in a single package feels really bad to me.

EDIT: Lets do it this way. Ask yourself what you think hero should provide to the game. To me, they should provide a front line distraction. Dodge and heal, formerly at least, were all survival tools.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

You want to nerf push, you want to remove snipers... Anything else you want to remove?

That was completely unnecessary.

Edit that post and the option should be there, if I remember correctly.

Normal users do not have a delete post function.

 

[Supa]

Normal users do not have a delete post function.

Yeah, I asked a team member without mod to see if there was a delete post option, but there wasn't one. My mistake. ;x

 

[Gumba]

The only reason Reb team consists of heros and jedi mostly is that they are the only classes

Dodge and heal, formerly at least, were all survival tools.

That's because hero a less tanky clone and only has 1 life.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

Yeah, I asked a team member without mod to see if there was a delete post option, but there wasn't one. My mistake. ;x

IVE MADE MISTAKES THAT MUST BE CORRECTED
PLS MASTA SUPA