Close Combat Training to increase walking/crouching/going backwards speed

[S o l d i e r]

Now that Close Combat Training 2 was removed from Open, Soldiers are somewhat lacking and can be very easily killed by Jedi/Sith. The get-up is really slow and so is the speed. Since Close Combat Training 2 was OP, there needs to be an intermediate solution between Close Combat Training 2 and not having it. I suggest adding a slight speed increase to walking/crouching/going backwards (either only to one of these forms of movement, two, or all) to either Close Combat Training 1 or a new Close Combat Training 2. This would give some more mobility to Soldiers when facing Jedi/Sith and it wouldn't be overpowered as the old Close Combat Training 2.

 

[k4far]

The key to using Sold now, is to abuse the grenade cheese. That is how they balanced the class. If you aren't holding a grenade, then you aren't playing the class correctly.

Stupid? Yes, but that is the way it is now.

Why is it wrong. As Hero/Bounty Hunter you have to use Pistol 3 with Disruptor or Project rifle or you would be playing it wrong - why is no one complaining about that? Lol.

 

[S o l d i e r]

Undead Deathstar was great, i wouldnt mind some nice reworks like this.

I'd rather that map was removed and only included during Halloween. It's really glitchy and normal Deathstar is much better.

I guess many come because of jedi/sith and the current "balance" would just drive them away.

Soldiers dont need more mobility, they are strong enough for a 3 live class and shouldnt have more chances against a saberist than a 1 live class, also they shouldnt have the chances they currently have.

So, now that everyone expects the Jedi/Sith to be the strongest class which they currently still are, and for them to easily kill everything like in Battlefront, let's dumb down other classes, otherwise people will leave MB2 and won't play it. I guess people cannot adapt to the fact that Jedi/Sith should be on par with other classes or be only a little more powerful than some and immediately jump to the fact that they should be the absolute strongest when balancing. They will always be the strongest. No one has that versatility and especially Push, the most useful thing in MB2. They still kill everyone with 1 hit and block all incoming fire with their sabers. No other class has that. They can jump anywhere, disable grenades, rockets and other gunners with Push, they have an unprecedented arsenal of skill points with various force powers and utilities. They cannot be called the underdogs ever.

The key to using Sold now, is to abuse the grenade cheese. That is how they balanced the class. If you aren't holding a grenade, then you aren't playing the class correctly.

Stupid? Yes, but that is the way it is now.

Why is it wrong. As Hero/Bounty Hunter you have to use Pistol 3 with Disruptor or Project rifle or you would be playing it wrong - why is no one complaining about that? Lol.

That's one of the wrong things. All skills should have the same value (of course, depending on their skill point cost). Right now you always have those skills that are superior and without which you suck as that class. This shouldn't be happening.

 

[DaloLorn]

Here's a few ways in which I "play the class wrong":

- According to Achilles, you need grenades to be a successful soldier. I sometimes max out my armor and ammo, and get CCT to move faster. If I use a grenade instead, it'll always be a frag grenade which I (often unsuccessfully) try to use to blow up groups of hostiles. Honestly, I don't perform very well here.

- According to K4, a BH must have a sniper rifle. He probably also expects darts. Me, I find it quite entertaining to max out every blaster I have, max out my armor, and go with ammo 2 - producing a walking armory with a gun for every occasion (except sniping, I suppose ) but limited utility against Jedi or snipers. Sometimes I do something similar as a hero, taking both blasters and maxing out my gunfighting stats (no dodge, though).

- According to common sense (and, if memory serves, Achilles), you need blobs to be a successful clone. Aside from disagreeing with the concept of blobs, I am also pretty bad at launching them - so I go without, instead maxing out my armor and boosting stamina to become a shock trooper capable of going toe to toe with most Imperial classes (lightning/grip Sith notwithstanding), with or without CR3.

 

[S o l d i e r]

What about making Close Combat Training 2 cost 26 skill points? That way you can't have Reinforcements 2, E-11 Blaster 3 and Close Combat Training 2 together.

 

[k4far]

What about making Close Combat Training 2 cost 26 skill points? That way you can't have Reinforcements 2, E-11 Blaster 3 and Close Combat Training 2 together.

I am only playing Soldier because if one of my careless tactics will fail I get to try another.
Reinforcement and Melee are important togheter. I would rather to have some worse rifle than less chances to not dump this class if things get changed a lot. Fast3r Fire Rate could be turned in to separate upgrade to E-11. That would contain the firepower and leave chances intact.

I do not like my own idea tho. Soldier has it rough already. It would be like when you are playing droid from Geonosis Arena, just limbs flying around. Not sure we want to mess up the most beginner friendly class to that extent.

 

[S o l d i e r]

I am only playing Soldier because if one of my careless tactics will fail I get to try another.
Reinforcement and Melee are important togheter. I would rather to have some worse rifle than less chances to not dump this class if things get changed a lot. Fast3r Fire Rate could be turned in to separate upgrade to E-11. That would contain the firepower and leave chances intact.

I do not like my own idea tho. Soldier has it rough already. It would be like when you are playing droid from Geonosis Arena, just limbs flying around. Not sure we want to mess up the most beginner friendly class to that extent.

I don't get what you are trying to say. You will still be able to choose Reinforcements 2 and Close Combat Training 2, but you won't be able to get E-11 Blaster 3, but only 2 then (E-11 Blaster 2 has less accuracy and less ammo clip than 3) and you won't have any more points to spend. Close Combat Training 1 would stay the same with the same point cost of 4 points, and CCT 2 would be 26 points for faster speed and get-up. Soldier would stay the same except it will have an additional skill - CCT 2. This will be completely balanced.

 

[k4far]

I don't get what you are trying to say.

I would extend E-11's upgrades to 4 in total. 4th would be the alt fire and earlier would just extend the clip. We would have a little less points, Soldiers with Pistol could be more common. I like the sound of that over having less lives. E-11 from Hero's loadout would have 3 upgrades as now, since he is a "Hero" all over-experienced prick, sounds reasonable. Soldier would feel a bit worse, but not unplayable.

Melee should stay as it is easy to grab and have fun. I will stick with that. I am trying to dissuade you off your idea haha.

 

[Jediknight Fou]

So, now that everyone expects the Jedi/Sith to be the strongest class which they currently still are, and for them to easily kill everything like in Battlefront, let's dumb down other classes, otherwise people will leave MB2 and won't play it. I guess people cannot adapt to the fact that Jedi/Sith should be on par with other classes or be only a little more powerful than some and immediately jump to the fact that they should be the absolute strongest when balancing. They will always be the strongest. No one has that versatility and especially Push, the most useful thing in MB2. They still kill everyone with 1 hit and block all incoming fire with their sabers. No other class has that. They can jump anywhere, disable grenades, rockets and other gunners with Push, they have an unprecedented arsenal of skill points with various force powers and utilities. They cannot be called the underdogs ever.

They are not the strongest class.
I dont expect to kill everything i actually just want to use red again against gunners again like before 1.4 thats really all i want a real fair chance with any style.
Things i expect are to be allowed to swing without getting lucktarded by some noob gunner who just sprays random and gunners fear saberists again like before flinchautoprotection was invented, 1.4 killed many tactic aspects in this game anyway.
All "superpowers" jump, push deflect doesnt help if your fp gets empty so fast and then you have to face noobflinch.
I dont know what the devs expected from 1.4.
I stay know with the team push and deflect like there is no morning and barely swing at enemy if hes aware of me.
If that is what devs and all nerfwhiners wanted, they won.

Also it sounds saberists are always close to you, maybe you should stop facehug them.
I know some people would strip all the unique things of the saberists which make them interesting and usefull and constantly whiny fools had luck with nerfwishes in the past, but believe me this will not serve this mod in the long run.

Soldier is a 3 live class, why should a 3 live class get more chance or the same than a 1 live class? A soldier should have the same chance like a hero? That makes no sense.
Give all classes 3 live or remove more live classes, then we can talk.

 

[S o l d i e r]

They are not the strongest class.
I dont expect to kill everything i actually just want to use red again against gunners again like before 1.4 thats really all i want a real fair chance with any style.
Things i expect are to be allowed to swing without getting lucktarded by some noob gunner who just sprays random and gunners fear saberists again like before flinchautoprotection was invented, 1.4 killed many tactic aspects in this game anyway.
All "superpowers" jump, push deflect doesnt help if your fp gets empty so fast and then you have to face noobflinch.
I dont know what the devs expected from 1.4.
I stay know with the team push and deflect like there is no morning and barely swing at enemy if hes aware of me.
If that is what devs and all nerfwhiners wanted, they won.

Also it sounds saberists are always close to you, maybe you should stop facehug them.
I know some people would strip all the unique things of the saberists which make them interesting and usefull and constantly whiny fools had luck with nerfwishes in the past, but believe me this will not serve this mod in the long run.

Soldier is a 3 live class, why should a 3 live class get more chance or the same than a 1 live class? A soldier should have the same chance like a hero? That makes no sense.
Give all classes 3 live or remove more live classes, then we can talk.

I am not asking for them to be as strong as a 1 life class in 1 life, that would be reintroducing CCT 2 in its old state. I think both of these suggestions for CCT 2 I suggested are fair, the one in the first post is a slight benefit and the one with increasing the cost of the old CCT 2 to a very high cost of 26 skill points pretty much disables you from using many other things when having it, thus crippling you. I just wish they were a little more viable vs Jedi/Sith, as the Jedi/Sith are a highly used class, and when you are a Soldier versus many Jedi/Sith you can't last for long or get many kills and you lose all will to play them any more.

 

[Jediknight Fou]

I am not asking for them to be as strong as a 1 life class in 1 life, that would be reintroducing CCT 2 in its old state. I think both of these suggestions for CCT 2 I suggested are fair, the one in the first post is a slight benefit and the one with increasing the cost of CCT 2 to a very high cost of 26 skill points pretty much disables you from using many other things when having it, thus crippling you. I just wish they were a little more viable vs Jedi/Sith, as the Jedi/Sith are a highly used class, and when you are a Soldier versus many Jedi/Sith you can't last for long or get much kills and you lose all will to play them any more.

Your wish to get buffs could be your downfall, a stronger soldier would mean more jedi/sith team up against you.
I fight gunner rarely alone, because flinch annoys me and interrupts anything i try with ease.
I believe you it can be annoying getting pushed or deflected to death, but most saberists i know including me get annoyed about flinch we just adapted to the situation and use what they left us to survive.
It is not a real solution to buff any gunner classes more because saberists adapted new tacticts because of the nerfs, this would only make things worse for everyone.

 

[S o l d i e r]

Your wish to get buffs could be your downfall, a stronger soldier would mean more jedi/sith team up against you.
I fight gunner rarely alone, because flinch annoys me and interrupts anything i try with ease.
I believe you it can be annoying getting pushed or deflected to death, but most saberists i know including me get annoyed about flinch we just adapted to the situation and use what they left us to survive.
It is not a real solution to buff any gunner classes more because saberists adapted new tacticts because of the nerfs, this would only make things worse for everyone.

I don't think you have so many problems with Soldiers as with other gunners. In contrast with them, Soldiers cannot even use their tactics. They walk to avoid Push when the saberists can Push and run away while the saberists can't Push when they are swinging their sabers because they are as fast as saberists. Soldiers on the other hand also walk while saberists can push, but they can't run away while the saberists are swinging because they are slower than saberists. They can only hope for a lucky flinch then. When you push other gunners, they can recover. When you push soldiers that means their certain death because they need years to get up. You literally have to be a fanatic with timing when you should run and even then you need even more luck or you are dead. Saberists can always use those tactics like jumping at the gunner and if he starts running you push, or saber them if they don't. Also if Sith has lightning they can jump at you and throw a brief lightning at you and you can't even run away cos you are so slow and can't shoot them for flinch cos of lightning and you are instantly dead. Also for grip, and speed is also more viable vs soldiers cos they are slower. It's even worse if you don't have Frag Grenade. You basically can't do without it versus saberists, and the only thing you can rely on then is a lucky flinch. Saberists can always move left-right before and while they are swinging to make it harder for you to land a succesful flinch. Plus, as you said there is also deflect, so you can't shoot saberists as much to reduce their force points. And those saberist tactics you mentioned are already there, I don't think anything will change if you give to Soldiers a small taste of what all other classes have, and not even what they all have, but only a small part of it for a very slight benefit that wouldn't be overpowered, wouldn't tick the scales in Soldiers' advantage (they would still be weaker than saberists, only a little bit less weaker) or cause any imbalance.

 

[{Δ} Achilles]

Here's a few ways in which I "play the class wrong":

- According to Achilles, you need grenades to be a successful soldier. I sometimes max out my armor and ammo, and get CCT to move faster. If I use a grenade instead, it'll always be a frag grenade which I (often unsuccessfully) try to use to blow up groups of hostiles. Honestly, I don't perform very well here.

- According to K4, a BH must have a sniper rifle. He probably also expects darts. Me, I find it quite entertaining to max out every blaster I have, max out my armor, and go with ammo 2 - producing a walking armory with a gun for every occasion (except sniping, I suppose ) but limited utility against Jedi or snipers. Sometimes I do something similar as a hero, taking both blasters and maxing out my gunfighting stats (no dodge, though).

- According to common sense (and, if memory serves, Achilles), you need blobs to be a successful clone. Aside from disagreeing with the concept of blobs, I am also pretty bad at launching them - so I go without, instead maxing out my armor and boosting stamina to become a shock trooper capable of going toe to toe with most Imperial classes (lightning/grip Sith notwithstanding), with or without CR3.

Yes, you can play those classes that way. You can also shove a banana up your ass and run around the neighborhood naked. Possible? Yes. Optimal? No.

You aren't getting anywhere fast against good players like that, there is a meta build, and it is set in stone. I use Pistol 2 on Clone *and nothing else* for fun, doesn't mean I would use it in a 1v1 against Paradine.

 

[Jediknight Fou]

Actually everyone can play how they want to play.
Balance messed up, bunch of trolls everyday, 24/7 dotf...i cant take the game serious atm anyway.
If someone wants to play a soldier only with melee or a wookie without strenght, even a saberist without push, let him.

 

[prejudicedroid]

Jus tek SDB, fuk teh Jadai and S3ldrgs.