Westar M5 overall ammo

[CC-1119 'Appo']

Am I the only one (probably, no one else is stupid enough to main arc ) who thinks the reserve ammo on this thing is so goddamn low? I find myself running out of ammo constantly, the magazine is fine but the reserve just isn't enough. You can't compete with snipers and you can't compete with soldiers at the moment so the M5's place, even with a sniper scope or without, is pretty much nonexistent as other classes do it much better and you can just take the dual pistols which are just flat out better than the m5 in terms of stats.

I'd suggest either:
A) reduce the ammo per shot from 2 to 1, then ammo 2 / 3 would be fair because as it stands, you get 18 sniper shots or 180 normal shots with ammo 2 which, unless you're somehow hitting headshots with every single shot, is not enough to kill more than 6 players and that's with a generous accuracy rating of 50%.

B) increase the reserve ammo, at least 1.5x times what it is now so, 360 for ammo 0, 540 for ammo 1 and around 720 for ammo 2.

Alternatively, you could beef up damage to compensate for low damage overall but, as it stands, I'd generally just take the pistols over the m5 every time if it wasn't for the goddamn awful deadzone of those pistols, you basically have to deliberately misplace your crosshair to fight in close quarters.

 

[DaloLorn]

Shouldn't this be in the Feedback subforum?

 

[CC-1119 'Appo']

Probably, looking for more input though. I don't think I've hit the nail on the head with one briefly thought out post.

 

[MoonmanMoonman]

make max ammo 600 and revert the fp drains on m5 westar to before the ninja nerf
Wow, suddenly ARC got less shit

 

[Charming Shaman]

I think the entire ARC class needs a revamp to be honest.
ARC's are a fast and agile class unless you take stamina 1 or 2, in which case you have to stop or walk often while heroes, BHs or even soldiers don't.
ARC's can resist force powers, but not really. Dexterity 3 allows you to counter attack siths who push you, but you're still affected by push and pull and very vulnerable to lightning and grip. Other classes that counter saberists pretty well, like deka, SBD or wookiees have the options to obtain actual immunities to force powers.
ARC's can snipe, but not really. The M5 scope just turns it into a bad p3, given that you HAVE to use the scope to do good damage and how small the blast is. You already covered the ammo part, Appo, so I don't need to mention it.

TL;DR: The ARC class has a clear edge when it comes to dodging, running away and taking down siths once you got a hang of the Pistol3/dex3/stam3 build. However it's a terrible sniping class. I'd take an E11 or an a280 over the m5 any day and for any situation. It's just a bad weapon compared to your other options in rebs. M5 needs a revamp to become something closer to the EE3 or something new.

Here's what I would do:
-remove the rocket launcher
-remove the sprint option and give ARCs regular jedi speed
-stamina now fuels jumps and rolls and is decreased when you take damage
-ARCs take damage when affacted by lightning, but can still shoot if they have dex 3
-to compensate for this, pistols and m5 can be force-pulled, unless they have dex 3 in which case it's only possible to snatch their weapons if they have low stamina
-Dexterity in the build menu stays the same
-Stamina in the build menu stays the same
-remove M5 2nd tier (the one that increases accuracy)
-the basic M5 stays as weak as it currently is and remains cheap BUT
-add more attachments to the m5: sniper mode (not as good as EE3 but close), frag grenade launcher, EMP grenade launcher, poison grenade launcher, blinding device launcher. Those attachments are only available if you have dex 2 or 1 for balance

By adding more options, you give the class actual roles in the team: you still have the arc-fu dual pistol option, but you now also have a unique, effective sniping build and a support/heavy weapons build.

Let me know what you think.

 

[CC-1119 'Appo']

I think the entire ARC class needs a revamp to be honest.
ARC's are a fast and agile class unless you take stamina 1 or 2, in which case you have to stop or walk often while heroes, BHs or even soldiers don't.
ARC's can resist force powers, but not really. Dexterity 3 allows you to counter attack siths who push you, but you're still affected by push and pull and very vulnerable to lightning and grip. Other classes that counter saberists pretty well, like deka, SBD or wookiees have the options to obtain actual immunities to force powers.
ARC's can snipe, but not really. The M5 scope just turns it into a bad p3, given that you HAVE to use the scope to do good damage and how small the blast is. You already covered the ammo part, Appo, so I don't need to mention it.

TL;DR: The ARC class has a clear edge when it comes to dodging, running away and taking down siths once you got a hang of the Pistol3/dex3/stam3 build. However it's a terrible sniping class. I'd take an E11 or an a280 over the m5 any day and for any situation. It's just a bad weapon compared to your other options in rebs. M5 needs a revamp to become something closer to the EE3 or something new.

Here's what I would do:
-remove the rocket launcher
-remove the sprint option and give ARCs regular jedi speed
-stamina now fuels jumps and rolls and is decreased when you take damage
-ARCs take damage when affacted by lightning, but can still shoot if they have dex 3
-to compensate for this, pistols and m5 can be force-pulled, unless they have dex 3 in which case it's only possible to snatch their weapons if they have low stamina
-Dexterity in the build menu stays the same
-Stamina in the build menu stays the same
-remove M5 2nd tier (the one that increases accuracy)
-the basic M5 stays as weak as it currently is and remains cheap BUT
-add more attachments to the m5: sniper mode (not as good as EE3 but close), frag grenade launcher, EMP grenade launcher, poison grenade launcher, blinding device launcher. Those attachments are only available if you have dex 2 or 1 for balance

By adding more options, you give the class actual roles in the team: you still have the arc-fu dual pistol option, but you now also have a unique, effective sniping build and a support/heavy weapons build.

Let me know what you think.

Honestly, all of this sounds great. The only thing I'd say is stamina might need less drain for jumps/rolls(lunge) if you can be disarmed with it on dex 3, whenever I play arc I'm usually floating around 30 - 40% of my total stamina because just running/jumping drains like crazy.

Just pls don't remove the 2nd tier of the M5 for accuracy, either combine it into the first tier and make the thing accurate on the move or leave the ranks as they are. I'm not a fan of dual pistols, prefer carbines myself

 

[Charming Shaman]

Honestly, all of this sounds great. The only thing I'd say is stamina might need less drain for jumps/rolls(lunge) if you can be disarmed with it on dex 3, whenever I play arc I'm usually floating around 30 - 40% of my total stamina because just running/jumping drains like crazy.

Just pls don't remove the 2nd tier of the M5 for accuracy, either combine it into the first tier and make the thing accurate on the move or leave the ranks as they are. I'm not a fan of dual pistols, prefer carbines myself

I understand your point, I'm just trying to figure out what could balance this kind of buff. Remember, you wouldn't need to spend stamina on sprint due to the regular speed buff.
Btw I've played a lot with M5 1 and M5 2 and I haven't noticed any difference in close and mid range. Try it, it saves points.
Hopefully the devs will consider our arguments for the next big patch!

 

[DaloLorn]

Now post all of this in his feedback thread.

But yeah, the M5 is a bit clunky. (Mind you, I love its scope because it has 100% accuracy, something the otherwise-superior A280 doesn't have.)