Tactical Discussion: Dealing with Force Lightning as gunner

[Lessen]

This thread is for talking about Lightning, and other faction-specific force powers, and their overall role. This thread is not for discussing potential changes. I'm just trying to get a better idea of how to respond to force users as a gunner.

My current understanding of lightning is that it is a tool designed mostly to give Sith free kills on lone gunners. It activates instantly, has a range similar to IDR, and locks up a lone gunner's ability to do anything but get decapitated. Since using force powers prevents you from blocking, I imagine that the main counter to lightning is to have a jedi or a second gunner on-hand to rescue you, and that lone gunners are simply completely incapable of doing anything other than getting facerolled by a lightning Sith. Is there anything I'm missing in this description of lightning?

Relatedly: What's the point of grip? Is it basically lightning with slower activation but some usability vs Jedi? Although... I remember trying to use it on Jedi and getting Force Pushed in response. I guess it gives a momentary vulnerability that could let a nearby gunner shoot the Jedi. Is the vulnerability long enough to get a saber hit in?

Mind Trick and Speed seem more subtle, but it seems like the faction specific force powers in general give Force users easy kills on lone gunners without helping them much vs groups, particularly mixed groups. A team saberist can block lightning, see through mind trick, and counter grip and speed with push. Is the idea to punish lone-wolf gunners and encourage teamplay? I've seen a lightning Sith seem to single-handedly chase a team (of gunners) around the map.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

Around the 25 second mark, watch what I do when he hits me with lighting.

 

[Lessen]

Huh. My experience with lightning has been that the Sith can hit me with their saber before I can get a shot off, but I haven't done any testing. The Sith you shot doesn't look like he even takes a swing. Aside from that, is there something special about crouching against lightning?

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

Huh. My experience with lightning has been that the Sith can hit me with their saber before I can get a shot off, but I haven't done any testing. The Sith you shot doesn't look like he even takes a swing. Aside from that, is there something special about crouching against lightning?

Crouching basically deals with the majority of offensive force powers. I perfer crouching over walking because it makes my hitbox small as possible when it comes to people swinging sticks.

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

Here is two demos I have saved, I was supposed to give this to ben but he just died and never got back to me on his tutorial series.
So I guess you can have them, below is timers I noted down. Use /seek to find the timestamps.
Ex. /seek 540

The one at 9 is the one im referring too about crouching making your hit box smaller.
Cloud city is the demo where that youtube video came from.
https://u.pomf.is/dmnxlo.mme

DOTF1_27_2016
2:00:00
3:40:00
6:00:00
9:00:00
11:31:86
19:17:00
21:46:26
25:32:00
32:41:00
33:20:00
33:50:00
36:19:00
37:00:00

https://u.pomf.is/vvrpfb.mme

CloudCity1_26_2016
1:30:00
8:20:00
10:36:00

 

[M@crobyte]

Depends on the class. But, assuming you don't have special skills such as dash or roll, you want to backup out of range while keeping your crosshair on the enemy and then shoot them. They can't run while using lightning, and they go about the same speed as if you were walking.

You also want to make note that you go backwards faster if you use strafe instead of holding "s". In other words, you could turn to the left or right and then strafe out of range, and then shoot. You want to be careful about how far you attempt to run because the sith more than likely has push 3.

My final tip would be tough it out. Depending on if the sith is very jumpy or pushy, more than likely, they are not going to have enough force to kill you by just holding lightning. This means they would have to charge you after the attack. If they use all their force shooting you with lightning, it means they have no force to block shots.

 

[Tiamatayyy]

Pretty much this ^
If you're on a 1v1 situation run back and get out of lightning range, he'll rush you, aim 2 the head and kill him easy peasy
if you're outnumbered, don't even try without dash or rolls lol

 

[EliteMasterLordofAll]

The stun lightning gives persists for a second or two after you stop using it, so its usually a good idea to do a quick blast into a gunner(s) to get a quick stun. Well its not really a stun, but they can't shoot with it so it lets your gunners get a free kill.

Grip is one of those things I feel like is just for fun. It is handy for killing gunners 1v1, even 1v2 if you're quick enough, since you only have to land grip for a second to hit them with your saber. I just use it to choke people for as long as possible, and sometimes I get to throw em off the edge of gen room in DotF.

I feel like push can do most of what grip/lightning can do, and probably better.

 

[Gumba]

A good sith never walks while doing lightning anyways. They jump and lighting to stun you and swing as soon as they land so there is no movement penalty on the lightning.

Best way to dodge this is to not run straight back but to strafe in the opposite direction to the swing.

Not the easiest thing to do but the most effective.

 

[SeV]

Relatedly: What's the point of grip? Is it basically lightning with slower activation but some usability vs Jedi? Although... I remember trying to use it on Jedi and getting Force Pushed in response. I guess it gives a momentary vulnerability that could let a nearby gunner shoot the Jedi. Is the vulnerability long enough to get a saber hit in?

I think it would be cool if grip could 'linger' and deal damage while the sith continued to fight on with his lightsaber. Who says he has to use his hand to grip ppl? Darth vader can do it from across a great distance, so why not be able to channel 'Grip' whilst holding block and swinging? Could redesign grip slightly.

Grip 1: Continues to do HP damage for a time after you've activated it and you're in-range. 2 second movement speed decrease on enemy.

Grip 2: enemy movement speed decrease (for 4 seconds max or smth, to make it not OP against jedi), 2 second stun so you can't shoot or swing lightsaber (but still block), and HP damage increase compared to grip 1, aswell as better FP economy and the ability to keep holding down the button and keep draining your FP to continue dealing damage. Again make a ceiling for it to stop working vs jedi after a certain amount like 5 secs or after force focus push/pull. Otherwise it would be too strong in jedi vs sith encounters, so need to allow jedi to counter it with force focus push.

Grip 3: is improved version of old grip 3. You can block and PB whilst using grip 3 and throwing ppl around, but you can't attack. Allow Grip 3+Push to work always despite FP levels. I'm not talking about super push, just the ability to pick someone up with grip and then fling him away and push to get extra distance.

 

[Chaos the Chaotic]

When getting fried by lightning:

Run away, the exact opposite direction from the sith - get out of his range.
If there are corners - use them to break his line of fire. At this point you can keep running or turn around and fire. The force cost is expensive and if you manage To hit him you'll drain it some more even if he`s in melee using two-handed lightning. You can drain force from ppl not using a saber.

In case you don't know - melee lightning does more DMG.
Lightning push - will actually push you out of range of his lightning unless there's a wall or something to block u behind d u.
So be aware wut he's using. Lightning push also has the longest stu so ppl use it in bursts against most everything except wooks.

After lightning, its important to remember they cannot use push temporarily. Run and blast for 2 seconds

Grip - nerfed to a pathetic joke. Already covered why multiple times but biggest peeve is against Jedi.
Grip a Jedi and any one of them can use push to break it, break it a d knock u down. I haven't used it in so long that I think u can be pushed down while gripping even while standing still. Or matpybe its that old speed bug. No fb Jedi could be knocked down while holding block and moving. Reason was, didn't count as walking even though the speeds were near the same. You had to hold walk and block. Maybe that's how it is with grip? Hold walk while gripping and u won't be knocked down, just back?

 

[BigBossBigTeef]

Nobody criticized my demos yet?
I must of posted good gameplay, or nobody cares and didn't watch them.

 

[Gargos]

Not sure if this is mentioned already but after the sith stops lighting, he has a 3 second delay until he can use push/pull. This means run as much as possible and blast.