Feedback Thread: Open Beta (after V1.4.9) - Drop 3

[CC-U11R]

Please,...

I am deeply disappointed about the changes for the stamina-perk. It makes it impossible for me as an ARC Trooper to play the class as I have since played it. The fact that you no longer regenerate Stamina while using Stamina's ability is a farce for all ARC troopers. The forced stop leaves any tactical scope for a Quake 3 based engine dead to the player. You have to keep moving all the time. So an ARC Trooper runs slower by default, this change makes it a wet potato bag on two legs, because the only movement it can win is Stamina and that one regenerates by standing still? Kind of paradox.

As a passionate mbii ARC Trooper player I wish that this change of Stamina will not be applied.

Yours sincerely CC U11R

 

[Lessen]

This is incorrect, walking faster thanks to holding stamina button always prevented stamina regen. In fact even if you didn't walk you still wouldn't regen, so it had to be simply holding the button that prevented the regen.

False! Super false! Although I was already super certain this was false, on principle I jumped in-game to test (on a live server, not the beta server), and your statement is absolutely entirely false. To test, I went clone with Stamina 0 and drained my stamina down to half. Then I started walking and observed that my stamina was regenerating. Then I held the stamina button (while still walking), observed my character jerk slightly as his speed increased, observed the overall speed increase, and observed that my stamina was still regenerating.

regenerate Stamina while using Stamina's ability

Is this specifically in reference to regenerating stamina while stamina-walking? Cuz if you're saying you could regenerate stamina while stamina-running, that's certainly false.

edit: By the way, CC-U11R, in the current beta you can still regenerate stamina while running, if you toggle your stamina ability back off. So you can still retain some mobility while regenerating, you don't have to stand still.

Really the only change from a balance perspective is that you can no longer regenerate while walking-fast. Which IS certainly a nerf, but seemingly not a huge one. That being said, overall I still believe clone/arc should get a buff to their base walk speed (in exchange for not being able to stamina walk/crouchwalk.)

 

[Stassin]

I don't know the current public state, talking only about 1.4.3 and before that. Yes, probably it was already changed a little bit in current public.

 

[CC-U11R]

False! Super false! Although I was already super certain this was false, on principle I jumped in-game to test (on a live server, not the beta server), and your statement is absolutely entirely false. To test, I went clone with Stamina 0 and drained my stamina down to half. Then I started walking and observed that my stamina was regenerating. Then I held the stamina button (while still walking), observed my character jerk slightly as his speed increased, observed the overall speed increase, and observed that my stamina was still regenerating.


Is this specifically in reference to regenerating stamina while stamina-walking? Cuz if you're saying you could regenerate stamina while stamina-running, that's certainly false.

edit: By the way, CC-U11R, in the current beta you can still regenerate stamina while running, if you toggle your stamina ability back off. So you can still retain some mobility while regenerating, you don't have to stand still.

Really the only change from a balance perspective is that you can no longer regenerate while walking-fast. Which IS certainly a nerf, but seemingly not a huge one. That being said, overall I still believe clone/arc should get a buff to their base walk speed (in exchange for not being able to stamina walk/crouchwalk.)

You're right, but cross-country skiers are also known to use their energy when they run (without active Stamina Perk). The absence of the stama makes confrontation with 2 Sith against 1 impossible. Currently, a 1v1 is already hard enough for me due to this change. Furthermore, the wallruns become too expensive because the stamina does not regenerate during the run. I don't need this change. Even after a dive you lack the stamina so much that your death is certain, because 40% of the staminas goes down the drain.

To surprise a Sith in his defensive position with a dive punch leaves no room to confront him with the missing stamina.

It is simply no longer fun to play ARC because of this change. I think it took this sentence to make it clear to you that I don't approve of the change because it destroys the fun of an agile Arc Trooper.

Compromise: Stamina on 2 points set

 

[Lessen]

You're right, but cross-country skiers are also known to use their energy when they run (without active Stamina Perk). The absence of the stama makes confrontation with 2 Sith against 1 impossible. Currently, a 1v1 is already hard enough for me due to this change. Furthermore, the wallruns become too expensive because the stamina does not regenerate during the run. I don't need this change. Even after a dive you lack the stamina so much that your death is certain, because 40% of the staminas goes down the drain.

To surprise a Sith in his defensive position with a dive punch leaves no room to confront him with the missing stamina.

It is simply no longer fun to play ARC because of this change. I think it took this sentence to make it clear to you that I don't approve of the change because it destroys the fun of an agile Arc Trooper.

Compromise: Stamina on 2 points set

I can't tell whether or not you understand how Stamina was changed. It sounds a bit like perhaps you haven't learned to turn off your stamina more often to let it regen. I mean, if you adjusted to the control difference, the only time you'd be losing more stamina than before would be while you're walking fast, and even then you could choose to instead walk slower but regenerate stamina.

(for context: I'm a very good anti-Sith ARC in the public build, so I have a pretty good understanding of the mechanics behind ARC. Although I don't use Wallrun much, and generally consider divepunch too risky, so....)

 

[CC-U11R]

I can't tell whether or not you understand how Stamina was changed. It sounds a bit like perhaps you haven't learned to turn off your stamina more often to let it regen. I mean, if you adjusted to the control difference, the only time you'd be losing more stamina than before would be while you're walking fast, and even then you could choose to instead walk slower but regenerate stamina.

(for context: I'm a very good anti-Sith ARC in the public build, so I have a pretty good understanding of the mechanics behind ARC. Although I don't use Wallrun much, and generally consider divepunch too risky, so....)

Of course I understood the change. The fact that you want to explain to me first how to deactivate Stamina shows me that you have not understood my contents of the text regarding Wallrun and Dive.

I am a front sow which confuses the opponent with Dive and Wallruns. You don't seem to understand that these two characteristics are directly affected by the change. Because the fight in confined spaces is directly affected.

For me, it destroys the Arc Trooper after 4 years of permanent play as ARC, the whole class.

My condolences that, despite your renovated time as Arc Trooper, you don't want to capture these changes in this context.

 

[Lessen]

@CC-U11R just to be clear, are you saying there was a further change beyond "stamina walking now drains stamina"? If there was, I've overlooked it. If you're saying that the nerf to stamina walking has that dramatic of an effect, I'll respect that; I haven't actually played ARC much in the Beta yet, I just didn't think it would make that much of a difference.

Again: I'm all for ARC/Clone having a faster default walkspeed, so as far as I can tell the changes I want to Stamina would solve your problem as well.

 

[Defiant]

False! Super false! Although I was already super certain this was false, on principle I jumped in-game to test (on a live server, not the beta server), and your statement is absolutely entirely false. To test, I went clone with Stamina 0 and drained my stamina down to half. Then I started walking and observed that my stamina was regenerating. Then I held the stamina button (while still walking), observed my character jerk slightly as his speed increased, observed the overall speed increase, and observed that my stamina was still regenerating.

What you are describing, is what we in the business call a "bug".

 

[Lessen]

What you are describing, is what we in the business call a "bug".

Well I've been playing for like 3 years and it's long been an integral part of my playstyle. It's a key part of Clone/ARC that they're just always able to walk that fast, IMO (and in the opinion of the angry ARC player above), so if you fix that bug you totally oughta buff their base walkspeed.

Also their default slow walkspeed triggers a much more egregious bug, as I've mentioned.

 

[CC-U11R]

@lessen
Hm,..
No. I'm not talking about Stamina consumption im walking. Only that the regeneration is switched off in normal mode. Hence my metaphor for cross-country skiers.

However, you are right, im walking while Stamina is activated, it is consumed as if one would run. This must not be and must be corrected.

If this change is applied, I will no longer play ARC Trooper. Since fun is the most important thing to me. And this change is killing all the fun in this class. Apart from the fact that my first attempt to increase the general running speed equivalent to the Mandalorian was not accepted and now this. really makes the Arc run like a fat ass after a Jedi/Sith by asking for a break to regenerate.

I do not recommend applying this change. Since the ARC appears to have different playing styles, which were not considered in this change.

 

[Lessen]

Only that the regeneration is switched off in normal mode.

I don't understand what this means. I'll hop in and test some things to be sure...

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, my bad, I only just from testing realized what your exact issue is: in the current beta, if you're running with Stamina turned off, you don't regenerate Stamina. It stays static. I didn't understand this from your previous explanations. I mean, your cross-country allusion implies what the problem is, but I didn't find any of your explanations straight-forward enough.

Yeah, going back and re-reading, none of your explanations were simple or clear. At one point you even said "you no longer regenerate Stamina while using Stamina's ability" which is just nonsensical. You meant "you no longer regenerate Stamina while not using Stamina's ability," right?? It doesn't seem like English is your first language tho so w/e

I do absolutely consider that an major problem. Given that the changelog does not mention this, I'm going to assume that's a bug.

@Tempest pls fix, ARC/Clone isn't regenerating stamina while running (with Stamina turned off).

 

[CC-U11R]

Oh,.. there was the important "NOT" missing! I'm realy sorry!

 

[Noob]

new weapon speeds make me feel like a god with ee3

 

[CC-1119 'Appo']

Happy to see @CC-U11R was keeping the flame of ARC-FU alive whilst I've been damn busy as of the past two years.

So having played some of the open beta - I honestly can't say I like or understand these stamina changes at all, it looks like regeneration while walking with stamina disabled only works when stationary? This is a huge blow to any movement-oriented MB2 player, and honestly is a bit of a let down considering I'm coming back to MB2 and the first thing I see is something that will completely remove the skill-intensive play style of ARC-FU that I enjoy so much.

CC-U11R is certainly right in saying that these changes will kill ARC for him, and for me. I can't say I'll bother to get re-invested in the game if the ARC-FU play style is being given this kind of death-blow nerf, albeit indirectly(?), through these stamina changes.

I really hope this is just a bug or an oversight, though I'm not sure what the idea for this change is? It worked fine just pressing the shift key to turn off sprint rather than pressing the sprint button again? So I do rather hope this is just something that is WIP due to its nature as an open beta test/proof of concept.

Gun play changes I can't say much, I'm extremely rusty after having just fired up the game for the first time in a long while but these stamina changes... god damn.

As for ARC changes specifically - can we please get an EMP cost reduction? I'm not paying 10 points for a grenade which has the 'potential' to be useful, assuming it doesn't get pushed away or we can't follow it up, compared to a few points for a frag grenade which deals health damage or a thermal detonator, which can 1HK - I'd buy EMPs maybe for 4 points, but not much more.

 

[jango40]

Quickthrow is a completely worthless waste of points, it needs a huge buff

 

[CC-U11R]

Happy to see @CC-U11R was keeping the flame of ARC-FU alive whilst I've been damn busy as of the past two years.

So having played some of the open beta - I honestly can't say I like or understand these stamina changes at all, it looks like regeneration while walking with stamina disabled only works when stationary? This is a huge blow to any movement-oriented MB2 player, and honestly is a bit of a let down considering I'm coming back to MB2 and the first thing I see is something that will completely remove the skill-intensive play style of ARC-FU that I enjoy so much.

CC-U11R is certainly right in saying that these changes will kill ARC for him, and for me. I can't say I'll bother to get re-invested in the game if the ARC-FU play style is being given this kind of death-blow nerf, albeit indirectly(?), through these stamina changes.

I really hope this is just a bug or an oversight, though I'm not sure what the idea for this change is? It worked fine just pressing the shift key to turn off sprint rather than pressing the sprint button again? So I do rather hope this is just something that is WIP due to its nature as an open beta test/proof of concept.

Gun play changes I can't say much, I'm extremely rusty after having just fired up the game for the first time in a long while but these stamina changes... god damn.

As for ARC changes specifically - can we please get an EMP cost reduction? I'm not paying 10 points for a grenade which has the 'potential' to be useful, assuming it doesn't get pushed away or we can't follow it up, compared to a few points for a frag grenade which deals health damage or a thermal detonator, which can 1HK - I'd buy EMPs maybe for 4 points, but not much more.

Hey Appo, a brother in spirit, together against the stamina change

Yes! The EMP-Nades are too expensive with 10 points. Set it equivalent to 5 points per dart of Bounty Hunter poison dart.

5pts per EMP-nade gives the ARC a good alternative against droideka/sbd and the player can adjust to the fighting behavior of the opponent's team without large losses (10pts per Nade), at the expense of other equipment points.

 

[Liniyka_xddd]

Quickthrow is a completely worthless waste of points, it needs a huge buff

Completely remove alt nade quickthrow, and make regular quickthrow free. I think mb2 could use some more free innate abilities for characters to make them more unique no matter the build.

 

[MuscBodypillow]

5pts per EMP-nade gives the ARC a good alternative against droideka/sbd and the player can adjust to the fighting behavior of the opponent's team without large losses (10pts per Nade), at the expense of other equipment points.

I agree with nade cheapening for arc (it's not like they did much damage and are pretty situational.)

 

[jango40]

Completely remove alt nade quickthrow, and make regular quickthrow free. I think mb2 could use some more free innate abilities for characters to make them more unique no matter the build.

I've never actually seen quickthrow 1 in use, maybe once or twice due to a mistake. It feels pretty useless, even if it would free ability. How to buff it while removing alt nade knockdown, I'm not sure. I mainly use quickthrow against annoying lightning sith, perhaps it could somehow be modified to make it better against sith or replaced altogether with a new ability against saberists?

 

[MuscBodypillow]

I've never actually seen quickthrow 1 in use, maybe once or twice due to a mistake. It feels pretty useless, even if it would free ability. How to buff it while removing alt nade knockdown, I'm not sure. I mainly use quickthrow against annoying lightning sith, perhaps it could somehow be modified to make it better against sith or replaced altogether with a new ability against saberists?

Maybe quickthrow could be replaced with something like "force resist" but that would be quite some change for heroes.