New UI Sucks

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I appreciate knowing the exact damage specifics with each loadout but as one keen user pointed out any change to the UI that increases the number of clicks you need to perform a task is not an improvement and in fact is a hindrance.
 
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MaceMadunusus

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The new UI is either less clicks depending on what you want to do, or equal. We have literally tested and counted this a number of times internally. It is not more clicks. The fact that you don't have to hit an okay button twice, is a huge benefit to the speed of things. The fact that you don't have to wait for a second menu to pop up is a huge buff.

If you want to join a team, chose model, and hit a preset:
Old: Escape -> Play -> Team -> Model -> Okay -> Point Template -> Accept (7 clicks/actions)
New: Escape -> Play -> Team -> Model -> Template Button -> Point Template -> Okay (7 clicks/actions)

If you want to join a team, model, and manually set points:
Old: Escape -> Play -> Team -> Model -> Okay -> Point Select -> Accept (7 clicks/actions)
New: Escape -> Play -> Team -> Model -> Point Select -> Okay (6 clicks/actions)

IF you want to update your build middle of round:
Old: Class Config Hotkey -> Point Template -> Okay (3 clicks/actions)
New: Class Config Hotkey -> Point Template -> Okay (3 clicks/actions)

If you want to update your model:
Old: Escape -> Play - > Model -> Okay (4 clicks)
New: Class Config Hotkey -> Model -> Okay (3 clicks)

If you wanted to chose a hilt, you still have to hit the hilt button in both menus, except depending on order of operations, you didn't have to hit the first okay button making it equal or shorter.

The only action that can be longer depending on how you do things, is updating RGB color after you are already in the round playing. If you do it before the round it is one less click. A very minor inconvenience for something that shouldn't be changing anywhere near as much as anything else.
 

Spaghetti

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Another improvement, changing class mid-round (excluding model select as it's neutral to both old and new UI):
Old: Escape -> Play -> Team -> Class -> Okay -> Point Template -> Accept (7 clicks/actions)
New: Class Config Hotkey -> Class -> Template Button -> Point Template -> Okay (5 clicks/actions)

one keen user
Very keen. Tempted to change thread title to "New UI Sucks (if you can't count)"
 

MaceMadunusus

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Only change I think would be great is the option to make esc->play->team default to template selection instead of to the model
This is so dependent upon how the individual person goes through the menu. I can probably make a separate menu layout that makes it default though and people can just switch to it. Might be over a week before I have time to do that though.
 
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So far this new UI only brought me suffering, even though it does look pretty. Now, I understand that it's probably due to me being unfamiliar with it, and the fact that it bugged out almost every single fucking time, but that's what my first impression was like.

It's not all bad though, as I said it is pretty, and it does seem like a step forward with these little videos and more information for less experienced players. So I guess we're gonna have to give it some time and see if it really works or not, because right now I'm kinda on the fence about it.
 
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This is so dependent upon how the individual person goes through the menu. I can probably make a separate menu layout that makes it default though and people can just switch to it. Might be over a week before I have time to do that though.
Objectively managing to select a template is more relevant than a model if you are rushing to get in a round.
 

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I like the new UI, however, someone said that it was counterintuitive and I caught myself on the same thought when I joined some other server, selecting sides.
I think there's too much empty space, it could be nice to have whole left side as a big button to join rebs and whole right side as a big button to join imps, not just tiny lines at the top of the screen. Basically stretch the Rebels / Imperials buttons all the way down.
Generally, I just don't feel like having to drag the mouse all the way up to click the relatively small button when there's whole screen available (and thus I could just move my mouse a few inches left or right instead of all the way up) is intuitive.
unknown (2).png

Making the whole green area clickable seems like a good idea to me.
P.S. This message was sponsored by Microsoft gang.
 
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The fact that you don't have to wait for a second menu to pop up is a huge buff.
It would be if you didn't split the menu up for no reason thereby adding an extra click anyway for most actions. Changing your class in game is still an extra click because the model menu is what gets brought up whenever you select a new one.

This seems to be a case of hyperfocusing on one aspect that the new thing improves while ignoring the new inconveniences. Hmmm...
 

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It would be if you didn't split the menu up for no reason
It's kind of obvious why - there isn't enough space to show everything simultaneously. The information density is still greater with the new UI and equal or fewer clicks to get to everything. It is objectively better in those aspects. Given the limitations of JKA's menu system it's frankly amazing (and a testament to the amount of work put into it) that we got the improvements we did at all.

...thereby adding an extra click anyway for most actions. Changing your class in game is still an extra click because the model menu is what gets brought up whenever you select a new one.
So you're just ignoring the fact it takes 2 fewer clicks to change class in-game now? The example I outlined before included selecting the build tab, which is the worst case scenario for the new UI. Even if for some reason you refused to use the class config hotkey and did the entire escape > play flow, that's still 7 actions, the same as before.

I think everyone needs to settle down and let some new muscle memory develop. You're comparing being used to a UI and join flow used for years (or over a decade for mod veterans) to something you've been exposed to for less than a week. Is that really fair?
 

MaceMadunusus

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Objectively managing to select a template is more relevant than a model if you are rushing to get in a round.
Yeah, which is why I'll make a second ui template so people can chose which path they would like to start with. I'll probably put the template one as default.

I think there's too much empty space, it could be nice to have whole left side as a big button to join rebs and whole right side as a big button to join imps, not just tiny lines at the top of the screen.
This is valid feedback, however the criticism bit of it is a bit odd. Not sure how its counter intuitive compared to our old UI anyway. However, there is some problems with doing that. Part of the reason the menus are built the way they are is the engine. If I do this, it means I have to add special things to code for the team balance/locking stuff so that it can find the proper menus as I would need two menus. One for the big button and one for the small buttons on top. If I also have the big buittons, we risk another click through issue that I can't solve as easy. The new UI is setup in specific ways to prevent you from clicking through one menu and hitting a button below it. It was a problem in an earlier version where hitting escape -> play would sometimes result in you hitting the spectator button as the menu popped up. I might be able to work around these and make it possible. We shall see.
 

Helix

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When writing that post, I had in mind something like this:
1598985876149.png


Yes, this isn't exactly what I proposed (full height buttons) but it still shows what I had in mind.
The base idea is two have two *BIG* buttons which clearly stand out from the surrounding UI and it's easy to reach and click them. As you see they're also situated in the middle of the screen, so people don't have to move their mouse up.
Also note that I'm not in any case a professional designer and I understand that I'm proposing a change that might go against the general UI flow.
 
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MaceMadunusus

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The base idea is two have two *BIG* buttons which clearly stand out from the surrounding UI and it's easy to reach and click them.
Yeah I know what you're talking about. The concern is more engine issues with doing that with click through, class limits, click eating, etc. I'll see if I can do it but I can't guarantee it. What we have now is still better than the old menu.
 
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When writing that post, I had in mind something like this:
View attachment 5073

Yes, this isn't exactly what I proposed (full height buttons) but it still shows what I had in mind.
The base idea is two have two *BIG* buttons which clearly stand out from the surrounding UI and it's easy to reach and click them. As you see they're also situated in the middle of the screen, so people don't have to move their mouse up.
Also note that I'm not in any case a professional designer and I understand that I'm proposing a change that might go against the general UI flow.
I agree, a front and center, or elongated from the top down that disappears when you pick faction would look appealing.
 

Lee

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7 clicks is wayyy tooo many to join. that's unheard of in most fps. u need to half it.

problem with new is where the clicks r needed...ALL OVER!!! there needs to AT LEAST be a fastjoin option with a default build. or better ur last config shud be carried upon join, or let us set a default config in options. and there shud be a single fastautojoin that sends u to the right team to balance. and it shud be a hotkey. so as soon as i join a server i can hit a single keyboard key and i join. meaning i can join within 1 second of connection. thats how things shud work. 1 click as the min, the max can be 7 or 10 or 20 whatever allows u to best select ur details.
 

MaceMadunusus

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there needs to AT LEAST be a fastjoin option with a default build. or better ur last config shud be carried upon join, or let us set a default config in options.
Did you play the tutorial? It literally tells you you can do that by setting your points, and overwriting the Default config. It will auto pick that on join, so you only need to click team -> class -> okay, if you're in a rush. 1 click joining is literally not possible with multiple teams, classes, etc. However, there was an auto team join button that I wanted to put in, but it doesnt work properly, but that still wouldnt account for what class you want to pick.
 

Lee

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Did you play the tutorial?
yes. im glad u taught ppl to roll to counter fall dmg, that was the tutorial imo.
The tutorial (if u can call it that) is a subject for its own thread. I stand by everything said. systems need to be streamlined. just installing this thing is a nightmare (every os brings new bulloney hoops to hurtle), getting in and playing shudnt be...so many things can be said here but ui needs streamlined. having model preview and builds on sep tabs is not the mentality needed. remember game options? they had the necessary, then an advanced tab. do that!
 

MaceMadunusus

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yes. im glad u taught ppl to roll to counter fall dmg
This is from the second tutorial available, that is after that first bit.

"If you type in the name as "default" and save as that then that will make your current points the default configuration you begin as when selecting your class."

It literally teaches you how to do what you were complaining about.

that was the tutorial imo.
The tutorial (if u can call it that) is a subject for its own thread.
This was an uneeded attack, especially when it is clear you did not even play through the entire tutorial to even have an informed opinion on the subject. Or the fact that there are only 2 levels of the tutorial that are available now, and 17 or so in the list in the tutorial menu that we want to add later.

remember game options? they had the necessary, then an advanced tab. do that!
I already said that I will be giving people options for their preferences.
 
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I won't state any technical opinion on this matter, however, I want to state that the current UI has prevented me from joining some matches where there were only a few seconds left.
I agree with @Lee. There should be a fast join option, or default option upon pressing a side, or having the possibility of directly choosing class without selecting team.
 
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