MapReview Blacony Dotf xD

Noob

Nerd
Donator
Posts
1,093
Reaction score
1,011
Did you hear that high note? that was the A above middle C. not too shabby *WUAH*
 

MaceMadunusus

Level Designer
Movie Battles II Team
Posts
1,412
Reaction score
1,830
I see foggy still doesn't understand basic English, particularly the part where I mentioned INCORRECT textures, or incorrectly scaled textures... not missing. So flying around the map at warp speed does not allow you to see those differences. Yes, missing textures are easy to spot, but I specifically said it was NOT that.

Oh, and some basic critical thinking skills are also necessary, where you need to check the current regular dotf as well... because they're sharing the same textures. Some of which were overwritten or changed slightly for the updated version, and dropping the old stuff in would overwrite it. There is a particular problem with the two button textures on the sides of the big door to gen where they become scaled incorrectly after recompile if you're using the wrong texture/shader combo and you don't notice. This isn't something you're going to magically spot flying around at warp speed, or know about without having dealt with the maps for a long time.

Having a debate in bad faith, makes me want to update it less. So good fucking job.
 
Posts
274
Reaction score
690
INCORRECT textures
sorry, im not an expert in shaders) come on, man you know precisely what i meant, don't pick on words :)

Oh, and some basic critical thinking skills are also necessary, where you need to check the current regular dotf as well... because they're sharing the same textures.
If you drop the balcony dotf in, nobody will even remember about the dotf 2.0 :p
And yes, i checked the new dotf textures as well, failed to find any major issues. Maybe you can help me with that? I asked you politely to provide some screenshots so everyone could see how dire and desperate the situation is, how much work needs to be done!

I made this video to illustrate a point that
DOTF_CLASSIC IS SIGNIFICANTLY WORSE THAT THE BALCONY DOTF IN EVERY POSSIBLE ASPECT AND THAT ALL SHORTCOMINGS OF MISSING OR "RESCALED" TEXTURES ARE OUTWEIGHED BY SIMPLY HAVING THE BALCONY DOTF

also about that perfectionist part, can you explain why did you decide to include dotf classic in the game in its current state?

ps.
one of the more significant aspects of critical thinking is the ability to accept different opinions and reflect on them *nudgenudge*
 
Posts
121
Reaction score
121
Having a debate in bad faith, makes me want to update it less. So good fucking job.
it's been 2 years. how much less motivated could you possibly get? no one cares about these minute texture issues. you're just making excuses so you can continue to be the spiteful child that you are

you added "classic" dotf, even though it's a broken imbalanced pile of shit, while knowing damn well the only version anyone wants is balcony. but no the most balanced map in the history of mb2 can't return due to a few insignificant texture issues that literally no one will notice or care about other than yourself.
 
Posts
121
Reaction score
121
while i agree with the rest of the message this part is untrue. Many people wanted Dotf v2 and the screenshots post got like 40 likes. Dotf v2 is a work of art, by far the most beautiful mb2 map, but one which you'd rather see in a museum rather than in a game :/
i agree. typed that out of frustration that built up by the end of my post and went to edit it right after but you are quick lol
 
Posts
18
Reaction score
28
I honestly don't get all the hate Mace is getting (and well, the devs in general). This is a free mod for a game published in 2003, played by a small community. The devs don't get anything in return for their hard work, besides experience in the field and personal satisfaction (some maps and models take months and months of development before they are released, since they have to be sure everything will be perfect and balanced). This is not a paid job, yet they dedicate some of their free time developing it instead of just minding their own business. If they didn't care, they would have left the project die ages ago.

Not everyone hates dotf V2 and the argument some people use: "only new players like it because they didn't play enough the old dotf" (not specifically talking about anyone who replied to this thread) is absolutely invalid. I have played since at least RC1 myself and I genuinely enjoy the map. It is good looking and balanced. It is clear a lot of work was put into it. But then again, everyone has their personal opinion.

Devs have their own jobs and lives to take care of.

People ask constantly for changes and even if sometimes very slowly, the devs always work on it and release updates with new content. Christ, some triple A games release less content behind paywalls and we are here complaining for free stuff we get.

Some people hate when they release only new models, like what happened with the latest hilts update and with previous patches which introduced more new models than actual gameplay changes.
Others hate when the new gameplay changes focus on different metas they are not used to.
Then there's the dueling scene demanding changes every single patch. Same for the open side.

Devs have constantly a lot of requests plus their own ideas they want to develop. Combine all that work with the fact they do it on their free time and boom.

Yes, maybe we have been waiting for balcony dotf for a really long time (it was my favorite map as well). But I don't think it is fair to hate at a team of people who keep trying their best to make most of the community happy, even if it's heavily divided.

The classic_dotf we got might not be the best version, but it was appreciated by some people like myself as nice touch, it is definitely a good throwback and brings back lots of memories.

We currently have lots of maps of which at least 40% are never played. We even have cmp maps and new maps are slowly being developed. There is a lot of variety.

If Mace said he will work on it, then he surely will. But people can't expect devs to miraculously work on all these different tasks and release stuff quick.
I understand it might be frustrating to wait 2 years, but with the constant requests and features they are eager to introduce: like new game modes, a new UI and all the gameplay changes, I can easily understand why bringing back an old map isn't the highest of their priorities.

This is my personal opinion anyways, you are free to think otherwise. I just felt like speaking my mind after reading this post and some of its replies.

Have a good day.
 
Last edited:
Posts
447
Reaction score
1,071
paid*

But people can't expect devs to miraculously work on all these different tasks and release stuff quick
Well that's the thing, there's no work required here - everyone would be happy if 1.3 dotf was simply added back, even if there were 1 or 2 weird textures in it. And don't forget, when it got removed, Mace promised to re-add it in a couple of months, and we see how that turned out.

Also, I really don't like how you make the devs look like saints who can do no wrong. Guess what, they can. And it's on us to call out bad decisions and bullshit when we see it, or this mod is gonna turn into fuck knows what before you know it.

In my personal opinion, the removal of old dotf was a horrible decision, probably the worst one in a very long time. Not only did it cause a massive backlash that still lingers to this day, it ruined the reception of dotf 2.0, which would have otherwise been received very warmly, as you can tell by the thread where it was first revealed.

It was a bad decision. It was called out by numerous people. And yet, to this day, Mace only CONSIDERS re-adding it, and doesn't admit that it was a bad call to remove it in the first place. It just seems like a big FUCK YOU, ya know? It might not be, but it sure seems like it.

"Don't like the new dotf? Well fuck you, the old one is coming back in 45 years cuz we're busy, and that's only if we're in a good mood".

I'm sure everyone understands that the devs are working on this part-time and for free. I'm sure that everyone is thankful for their work. I'm sure that everyone appreciates good content and changes when they come out.

But that doesn't free them from criticism and responsibility. They may be volunteers, but that doesn't mean that they can shit all over this mod if they wanted to, and expect us to be fine with it.

If they fuck up, we gonna call it out. If they make bad decisions, we gonna call it out. That's how it should be, and that's how it will be, no matter what.
 
Posts
18
Reaction score
28
Well that's the thing, there's no work required here - everyone would be happy if 1.3 dotf was simply added back, even if there were 1 or 2 weird textures in it. And don't forget, when it got removed, Mace promised to re-add it in a couple of months, and we see how that turned out.
There is some degree of work required but I get your point. It was indeed not one of the best decisions.

Also, I really don't like how you make the devs look like saints who can do no wrong. Guess what, they can. And it's on us to call out bad decisions and bullshit when we see it, or this mod is gonna turn into fuck knows what before you know it.

In my personal opinion, the removal of old dotf was a horrible decision, probably the worst one in a very long time. Not only did it cause a massive backlash that still lingers to this day, it ruined the reception of dotf 2.0, which would have otherwise been received very warmly, as you can tell by the thread where it was first revealed.

It was a bad decision. It was called out by numerous people. And yet, to this day, Mace only CONSIDERS re-adding it, and doesn't admit that it was a bad call to remove it in the first place. It just seems like a big FUCK YOU, ya know? It might not be, but it sure seems like it.
I get your point and I'm totally fine with people giving some constructive criticism. Hell, even I criticize the things I don't like. But there's a difference between criticizing a feature you don't like and straight up insulting someone who works hard for the community.
Also no, devs aren't saints and I never even intended that. People make mistakes, including them. I was one of the first to criticize the instacounter build (talking about duel mode here), and I am also against the projectile speed increase. I openly say I am against some changes, but there's no need to make fun of the guy and flame him in a thread. I agree with you on the fact removing balcony dotf in the first place wasn't the best idea, but what's done is done. Lets just hope it is added back.
 
Last edited:

Hessu

Internal Beta Team
Posts
312
Reaction score
447
Just bring back 1.3 dotf, work on dotf 2.0 till its ready for release. I just don't get it why Mace brought b19 dotf, the worst fucking map on this game back instead of the 1.3 one that everyone was asking for!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? He used 10 hours to bring that wankstain back on this game but can't do it on the map that everyone is asking for. No hate for mace but AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
 
Posts
27
Reaction score
131
DOTF isn't even an interesting or good map, it's just the 2Fort of MB2. IDK why y'all are white knighting for it so hard.

Theres plenty of other maps that are good or even great in both design as well as looks but everyones too stuck in their nostalgia to even bother thinking about it.

DOTF is plagued with dual entry point design (when good map theory suggests that there has to be at least 3) as well as room-corridor-room syndrome. There's barely any height variation and when there is, it's only use is to boost only select classes effectiveness (Mandalorian and Jedi/Sith).

Everyone here's looking goofy thinking that a balcony will somehow make it a
into a good map.
Tylenol isn't even an interesting or good player, he's just the Ninja of MB2. IDK why y'all are white knighting for him so hard.

Theres plenty of other players that are good or even great in both personality as well as looks but everyones too stuck in their contempt to even bother thinking about it.

Tylenol is plagued with dual STDs (when good contraception suggests that there have to be at most 1) as well as down-syndrome. There's barely any height on him and when there is, its only use is to boost his ego next to a few select even shorter individuals (Aaron and Fives).

Everyone here's looking goofy thinking that a slap on his ass cheek will somehow make him into a good human being.
 
Top